Assange seeks asylum....in Ecuador Embassy

Sabot wrote:
It would be possible to get him out using submarines and or private boats, but a huge amount of trouble.

Lamplighter wrote:

Sabot wrote:
It would be possible to get him out using submarines and or private boats, but a huge amount of trouble.

You still have to get him out of the embassy, ma petite, and the moment he steps through the gate he is off Ecuador land and back on UK soil. And I don't think the Embassy is anywhere near the Thames or over one of its underground subsidiaries! LL

Sabot wrote:

Lamplighter wrote:

Sabot wrote:
It would be possible to get him out using submarines and or private boats, but a huge amount of trouble.

You still have to get him out of the embassy, ma petite, and the moment he steps through the gate he is off Ecuador land and back on UK soil. And I don't think the Embassy is anywhere near the Thames or over one of its underground subsidiaries! LL

Ah Ha! But have they got Secret Tunnels? Or they could take him out over the roof. For all we know, he's gone already. He could even be hiding somewhere else in UK.

Lamplighter wrote:Found this on the BBC website re barriers to possible US Assange prosecution. LL

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11952817

Roxon letter spurs Assange flight to Ecuador embassy
Philip Dorling
June 21, 2012

Ecuador to judge Assange 'on principle'
Ambassador to Ecuador Raul Gangotena says his country won't bow to the demands of other nations when deciding Julian Assange's application for asylum.

JULIAN ASSANGE decided to seek political asylum in the Ecuadorean embassy in London because he felt abandoned by the Australian government, WikiLeaks insiders say.

Mr Assange's closest confidants say they were surprised by his move but have no doubt that it was triggered by a letter from the Attorney-General, Nicola Roxon, that Mr Assange's lawyers describe as an ''Australian declaration of abandonment''.

In the letter to one of Mr Assange's legal representatives, Australian human rights lawyer Jennifer Robinson, Ms Roxon made it clear that Australia would not seek to involve itself in any international exchanges about his future.

Ms Roxon wrote: ''Australia would not expect to be a party to any extradition discussions that may take place between the United States and the United Kingdom or the United States and Sweden, as extradition is a matter of bilateral law enforcement co-operation.''

She also took the opportunity to advise Ms Robinson that ''should Mr Assange be convicted of any offence in the United States and a sentence of imprisonment imposed, he may apply for an international prisoner transfer to Australia''.

Mr Assange's lawyers characterised Ms Roxon's reply as a ''declaration of abandonment''. Some of his closest associates first learnt of his decision to seek political asylum when journalists rang them seeking comment overnight after the WikiLeaks publisher sought the protection of the Ecuadorean government.

''I didn't know about it, it came as a complete shock,'' one of Mr Assange's small WikiLeaks team told the Herald.

Earlier, Mr Assange said in a short statement: ''I can confirm that today I arrived at the Ecuadorean embassy and sought diplomatic sanctuary and political asylum. This application has been passed to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in the capital Quito.''

The affair took another turn last night when the BBC reported Mr Assange faced arrest by Scotland Yard for breaching bail conditions. The conditions required Mr Assange to live at a friend's house in Norfolk, the BBC reported.

Mr Assange failed last week to persuade the British Supreme Court to reopen his appeal against extradition to Sweden to be questioned about sexual assault allegations.

Mr Assange, who has not been charged with any offence in Sweden, has expressed grave fears extradition to Stockholm will facilitate his ultimate extradition to the US on espionage and conspiracy charges relating to the alleged leaking of hundreds of thousands of classified military and diplomatic documents.

The Ecuadorean Foreign Ministry issued a statement that said Mr Assange's application for asylum referred to a ''regrettable factual statement of abandonment'' by the Australian government that made ''it impossible to return to my home country and put me in a state of helplessness to be requested for questioning by the Kingdom of Sweden … and investigation for political crimes in the United States of America, a country where the death penalty for such offences is still in force''.

The Foreign Affairs Minister, Bob Carr, and the Prime Minister, Julia Gillard, have repeated that the government ''has no evidence'' of any US intention to charge and extradite Mr Assange, though Ms Gillard added the qualifying words ''at this stage'' in answer to a parliamentary question from the Australian Greens deputy leader, Adam Bandt.

The Australian embassy in Washington reported in December 2010 that WikiLeaks was the target of an ''unprecedented'' US criminal investigation ''into whether Julian Assange can be charged under US law, most likely the 1917 Espionage Act''.

Ecuador offered Mr Assange residency in late 2010 but rescinded the offer after controversy erupted and the US government reportedly made diplomatic representations against such action.

Sabot wrote:
Perhaps America should look at it's Death Penalty Laws. Although far be it from me to insist. But The Death Penalty does still exist in certain States for this sort of supposed Crime.
Which State would he be extradited to, and does this State have The Death Penalty?

Tough laws

Sweden has one of the toughest laws on sexual crime in the world - lawyers sometimes joke that men need written permission first.

"It is not necessary to have a lot of violence. That is what people usually think, but in practice if you force someone to have sex with you against their consent you don't have to use much violence at all. Or you can take advantage of a difficult situation for the woman in question."

Assange knows that this case is simply a matter of what happened with the two women rather than a bigger conspiracy.

Three categories

The sexual allegations

'Unlawful coercion' against Miss A - pinning her down
'Sexual molestation' by refusing to wear a condom with Miss A
'Deliberate molestation' of Miss A
'Rape' of Miss W: had sex with her while she was sleeping and without a condom
Source: Gemma Lindfield, lawyer acting for the Swedish authorities

Under Swedish law, there are legal gradations of the definition of rape.

There is the most serious kind, involving major violence.

But below that there is the concept of 'regular rape', still involving violence but not violence of the utmost horror.

And below that there is the idea of 'unlawful coercion'. Talking generally, and not about the Assange case, this might involve putting emotional pressure on someone.

The three categories involve prison sentences of 10, six and four years respectively.

The lawyer for the two women who have complained against Mr Assange will not spell out the details because he says that would give too much away to the accused man.

But he does indicate that it is a four-year sentence that Mr Assange could expect, indicating that he is suspected of this third, less serious category.

Questions to answer

The case may turn on if or when consensual sex turned into non-consensual sex - is a male decision not to use a condom a case of that, for example?

Under Swedish law, Mr Assange has not been formally charged. He has merely been accused and told he has questions to answer.

The process is for the prosecutor to question him to see if a formal criminal accusation should then be laid before a court.

There would then be a hearing in front of some lay people to see if that formal charge should go to a formal trial.

The attitude towards rape in Sweden - informed by a strong sense of women's rights - means that it is more likely to be reported to police.

Some 53 rape offences are reported per 100,000 people, the highest rate in Europe.

The figures may reflect a higher number of actual rapes committed but it seems more likely that tough attitudes and a broader definition of the crime are more significant factors.

Lamplighter wrote:

Sabot wrote:
Perhaps America should look at it's Death Penalty Laws. Although far be it from me to insist. But The Death Penalty does still exist in certain States for this sort of supposed Crime.
Which State would he be extradited to, and does this State have The Death Penalty?

As there is no evidence the US wants him anyway, who can answer that? LL

Sabot wrote:

Lamplighter wrote:

Sabot wrote:
It would be possible to get him out using submarines and or private boats, but a huge amount of trouble.

You still have to get him out of the embassy, ma petite, and the moment he steps through the gate he is off Ecuador land and back on UK soil. And I don't think the Embassy is anywhere near the Thames or over one of its underground subsidiaries! LL

Ah Ha! But have they got Secret Tunnels? Or they could take him out over the roof. For all we know, he's gone already. He could even be hiding somewhere else in UK.