Five dead in shooting involving UK car in France

The UK is less reserved:

http://news.sky.com/story/981484/france-shooting-bullet-ridden-bmw-removed

IMo, they were targeted either by Middle East nutters or Breivik sympathiser nutters.

Mr al Hilli had been working as a freelance engineer for Guildford-based Surrey Satellite Technology after fleeing Saddam's Iraq, neighbours said.

Whatever the reason, there is never, ever an excuse. It breaks my heart to think of a British family, on holiday in a beautiful part of France, being massacred.

Those poor, poor children - and the idiot police not not finding the little one under her mum for eight hours.

I don't have the words. And yes, I would bring back the death penalty for whoever did that.

The couple's four-year-old daughter, named locally as Zeena, was discovered alive hiding under her dead mother's skirt several hours after police arrived on scene.
She told police how she was so terrified she 'could not tell the difference between the good guys and bad guys'. A passing cyclist was also killed, leading police to believe he may have been shot as he witnessed the 'hit'.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2198777/Lake-Annecy-shooting-French-Alps-Girl-4-ALIVE--murdered-father-named-Saad-Al-Hilli.html#ixzz25jSEHfW7

The survivors from Breivik said the same thing.

The survivors from Breivik said the same thing.

Oh dear God.

I pray to God it isn't, Lily, but the survivors from Brievik all said they couldn't tell who was good and who was bad.

The poor souls, Bonny. It all seems so unimaginable and yet, it has happened.

http://news.sky.com/story/982705/french-police-stand-firm-in-face-of-questions

French Police Stand Firm In Face Of Questions

Martin Brunt
Crime Correspondent
More from Martin | Follow Martin on Twitter

Anyone expecting details of police progress in the Alps murder investigation must have been sorely disappointed.

The authorities do things differently here ... it was a press conference, but not as we know it.

In France the public clearly has no right to information about how well or otherwise the police are doing in their hunt for the killers.

And that might explain why, in three media briefings since the murders, neither the public prosecutor nor the detectives have made any plea for the public's help.

No witness appeal, no call for CCTV footage, no hotline for information that might help solve one of the country's most horrific and high-profile murders.

Many legitimate questions were dismissed with a perfunctory "I'm not going to answer that".

One reporter - the public's representative, after all - was slapped down with: "Why are you asking me this question?"

Prosecutor Eric Maillaud, an otherwise charming and affable man, said there would be no more press conferences for now and would journalists please stop ringing his mobile. Someone important might be trying to get through.

He said he and his colleagues needed to maintain "judicial secrecy" to avoid prejudicing the investigation.

We heard a lot of that in Portugal five years ago when Madeleine McCann vanished from the family's holiday apartment.

It was even more frustrating there ... to the Portuguese authorities a press conference was an alien concept.

And when they were badgered into holding one, it developed into a farce with virtually everyone's question left unanswered.

So let's be grateful for the odd titbit that was thrown to the hungry hack-pack at the latest briefing.

Having earlier dismissed our revelation that the victims had each been shot twice in the head, Mr Maillaud confirmed that it was indeed true.

Such a clinical and methodical murder once again raised the theory of a professional hit, something the prosecutor has been keen to play down.

In the UK the public is regularly urged to provide information to help solve major investigations.

British cops treat the public as so many more "eyes and ears".

Frustratingly, Surrey police have taken their lead from the French and told us even less about their role in searching the victims' home and interviewing their relatives on behalf of the Gallic investigators.

In the briefest of statements the assistant chief constable said they were supporting the French police, they will support the victims relatives and had sent family liaison officers to France.

And no questions thank you very much for coming goodbye.
----------------

Let's hope it improves on failing to notice there was a survivor for eight hours.

Let's hope that Martin Brunt learns to shut his big mouth. He did enough damage in The McCann Affair with leaks from The Police.
Sarcastic Barstard. Who the f*ck does he think he is?

Sorry, not going to blame The Gendarmes for failing to notice that small child. I expect that they are already blaming themselves.

You're right, Sabot, I am sure they felt dreadful when they found the little girl - I actually cannot think of anything similar happening, except in horror stories.

And it's an unfortunate fact that France has, sadly, had to deal with massacres and assasinations before. They aren't going to be out of their depth in dealing with it.

No, Bonny. France isn't going to be out of it's depth. Too much practice, as you say.
The Killer didn't know that there were two children, and nor did The Gendarmes.

I honestly don't know what should be done in these circumstances where they don't want to disturb a Crime Scene. And these were very much Provincial Gendarmes. They did use a Heat Seeking Device, but the child was too small and too tangled up to be able to be separated from the other two bodies. And she was too afraid to holler.

Yep, I am defending The French Police. Most of them are very good at their jobs. And they notice far more than most people realise. I personally know this to be true.

I'm not even going to guess what this is about...

http://news.sky.com/story/983064/alps-shooting-bomb-unit-at-family-home

quote:

Alps Shooting: Bomb Unit At Family Home
Roads surrounding the home of a British family shot dead in France have been cordoned off and neighbours evacuated from the area.

A bomb disposal unit has arrived at the house of a British family found shot dead in the French Alps.

Police have cordoned off two roads outside Saad al Hilli's home in Claygate, Surrey, due to "concerns" about items found in the house.

Aerial pictures showed the Royal Logistic Corps bomb squad's investigation appears to be focused on a workshop at the bottom of the garden.

Sky's Ashish Joshi, at the scene, said a Perspex sheet has also been put up outside the front door of the large, mock-Tudor property.

Surrey Police said in a statement: "We can confirm that due to concerns around items found at the address ... officers have extended the cordon surrounding the property.

"Neighbours in the immediate area are being temporarily evacuated."

...And the hounders are now smearing, oops, I mean 'speculating', about the Brit who was first on the scene.

No doubt they got bored with smearing the victims.

My friends, this was taken from Sky News:

http://news.sky.com/story/984453/alps-killings-investigators-head-to-britain

http://news.sky.com/story/984702/alps-murders-witness-talks-of-awful-dilemma

Alps Murders: Witness Talks Of Awful Dilemma
The British man who discovered the bodies in the Alps shooting speaks of his ordeal.

The British cyclist who chanced upon the scene of a quadruple murder in the French Alps has spoken of his horror at the discovery.

Brett Martin found members of the al Hilli family shot dead in their car and their seven-year-old daughter collapsed at the side of the road.

He said his toughest choice was having to leave Zainab, who had been shot and badly beaten, so that he could get help.

"It was an uncomfortable decision," he said.

Mr Martin, from East Sussex, said that he had to leave the scene to get telephone signal so he could call for help.

"She was light so I could've done a fireman's lift and taken her on my bike," he said.

"But she had injuries and it seemed from the very low level medical training that I've had that if there's a risk of internal bleeding and wounds, dragging her along like a ragdoll over my shoulder might have killed her."

He said that he left the child in the recovery position and went for help.

Mr Martin, a former member of the RAF, said he initially believed there had been a car accident after coming across the scene while cycling in the forest.

"As I got a little bit closer a very young child stumbled out into the road. At first I thought she was just playing with a sibling, she was falling over and larking about like a child would.

"However as I approached her it was obvious that she was quite badly injured."

He added: "I've never seen people who have been shot before".

"It seemed to me just like a Hollywood film, but unfortunately it was real life.

"I thought maybe there was some crazy person in the woods. I started scanning the woods to see if there was a nutter hiding and I was going to be the next person shot."

Saad al Hilli, 50, and his dentist wife Iqbal, 47, were murdered along with her mother - named in reports as Suhaila al Allaf - in a remote spot close to Lake Annecy a week ago.

French cyclist Sylvain Mollier, 45, who is believed to have stumbled across the scene, was also shot dead.
===========

No doubt that will give Bennett's lot further excuses to smear the victims and, well, just about anyone else they feel like pointing their fingers at and 'speculating' about.

Oh FFS!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19587311

Meanwhile, a French prosecutor has said the motive has its "origins" in the UK.

Not again! Why is he saying ANYTHING when the investigation is ongoing? The armchair defectives will have a field day of blaming the victims yet again.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/9547495/French-police-cyclist-may-have-been-target-of-Annecy-slaughter.html

French police: cyclist may have been target of Annecy slaughter

A French cyclist who was shot dead alongside a British family in a massacre in the Alps may have been the "main target" of the massacre, police have suggested.

By Victoria Ward9:44AM BST 17 Sep 2012
Lt Colonel Benedict Vinnemann, who is leading the police inquiry, revealed he was considering the possibility Sylvain Mollier, the cyclist, was the real target. He was buried yesterday.
It had previously been suggested that Mr Mollier was killed because he had interrupted the killing of Saad al-Hilli, his wife and mother-in-law by a hitman.
But Lt Col Vinneman said: "Was the al-Hilli family the main target? Was it not the cyclist? Only ongoing work on the scene can answer this question clearly.
"We're talking about someone whom everybody says was a gentleman, but who's to say he did not lead a double life?"
French police were yesterday accused of “playing politics” over the Alps massacre by asserting that the origins of the case lie in the UK.

Brian Paddick, the former Metropolitan Police Deputy Assistant Commissioner, said that unless there was clear evidence that ruled out the other theories, it was “dangerous” to switch the focus of the investigation to this country.
“It smacked to me of more of a political decision than a professional police one,” he said.
“It was as if they did not want the reputation of France, and particularly this picturesque tourist spot, damaged by the suggestion that this could be anything to do with the French police or people in that area.”
French police investigating the deaths of Saad al-Hilli, 50, his wife Iqbal, 47, her mother Suhaila al-Allaf, 74, and a passing French cyclist in Annecy, south-eastern France, have stated that they are working on three lines of inquiry; a bitter family feud over inheritance, Mr-al-Hilli’s work as an aeronautic engineer and his Iraqi origins.
It emerged yesterday that the French investigation is being scaled back, with many of the original 120 gendarmes working on the case returning to normal duties after Eric Maillard, the chief prosecutor in Annecy, said that he was convinced the answer to the mystery lay in the UK.
Mr Paddick added: “When you do not have any clear front runner in terms of theories, you need to pursue each of the potential explanations relentlessly.”

DCI Colin Sutton, a retired detective who investigated the Levi Bellfield murders, suggested that such an approach could be short-sighted unless there was specific evidence to back it up, although he noted that the French police were unlikely to divulge too much detail about their progress.
“It seems (Mr Maillard) may have closed his mind completely to the case having its roots in France,” he said. “Unless they have any evidence to base that on, it seems a little dangerous to me.”
Mr Mollier worked for Cezus, a subsidiary of the Areva Group, specialising in zirconium metalworking for nuclear fuel containers.
The victims are believed to have been shot with a Luger P08, a distinctive weapon which was standard issue to the Swiss army and which fires distinctive 7.65mm calibre bullets.
The weapon has a capacity of eight rounds meaning that a lone gunman, who fired around 25 bullets during the massacre, would have used more than three magazines.

===============


“It was as if they did not want the reputation of France, and particularly this picturesque tourist spot, damaged by the suggestion that this could be anything to do with the French police or people in that area.”

Sounds familiar....

It sounds to me as though far more effort was made to ensure the death of the cyclist. More bullets were fired into him than the family. It has been suggested that the father was there to meet the cyclist, and as far as I can remember the body of the cyclist was found alongside the car.

That does make sense, Sabot.

It occurred to me that if the cyclist had come upon the shootings of the family then he would have been found a least some small distance from the car, and not that close. He would be hardly likely to cycle into the middle of a mass murder.

Again, that makes sense of the seemingly senseless, Sabot.

I am wondering if Classified Information was changing hands. Both the Father and the Cyclist appear to have have been working in highly sensitive industries.
But The French are going to be a bit careful about what they have to say about it.

By the way, that road was actually closed at one end, and sign posted as such. It might have been a beauty spot but there wasn't a lot else to see for an ordinary tourist family with two small children getting bored in the back of a car.