Euro debate - Clegg v Farage

There was a bit of a ding-dong between the two on telly last night, which I didn't watch due to finding both of them intensely annoying.

However - polls suggest Farage made mincemeat of Clegg. Which wouldn't be hard.

http://news.sky.com/story/1232873/clegg-accuses-farage-of-siding-with-putin

Nigel Farage's claim that the EU has "blood on its hands" over the Ukraine crisis is "perverse", Nick Clegg has said.

After apparently coming second in Wednesday night's live debate, the Liberal Democrat leader took questions about his performance on his weekly phone-in show with talk radio LBC.

He said: "Clearly a lot of people didn't agree with me. But this is a marathon, not a sprint."

He said "myths" on Europe had been put out by Mr Farage "unchallenged". You cannot turn that around in an hour, he said.

He also accused Mr Farage of "siding with Putin" over the Ukraine crisis after the UKIP leader said the EU had "blood on its hands" for encouraging revolution.

Asked about Mr Farage's comment, Mr Clegg said the remark was made at the end of the debate so he was unable to respond and found it the "most striking, if not shocking" revelation of the debate.

He said it was "such a perverse way of looking at things", adding Russia's annexation of Crimea was "simply unacceptable".

The DPM said the UKIP leader's comments showed "how extreme people can be when their loathing of the EU becomes so all-consuming that they side with Putin".

A clear majority of voters believed Mr Farage beat Mr Clegg in the bitter and impassioned clash, with some 57% of 1,003 people in a YouGov poll pointing to the UKIP leader as the victor, compared to 36% in favour of the Europhile DPM.

A poll on @SkyNews also had the UKIP leader as the winner of the hour-long debate - with more than 1,300 retweets compared with Mr Clegg's 550. The LBC Twitter Worm also called it for Mr Farage.

Mr Clegg argued Britain was "better off in Europe - richer, stronger, safer", but the leader of Eurosceptic UKIP insisted the "crumbling EU isn't working".

Mr Clegg warned leaving the European Union would have "massive consequences" for Britain "for generations to come".



He said that to "simply pull up the drawbridge" would be "devastating" for the UK and "destroy jobs for everyone in our country".

Mr Farage attacked his rival for not supporting a referendum on Britain's EU membership, saying the current situation was "not fair" on British workers.

The clash at a central London hotel - live on LBC and Sky News - was chaired by LBC breakfast host Nick Ferrari and will be followed by a second next week on BBC2.

The debates are likely to be the highest-profile events of the political campaign for the European Parliament and UK council elections, which take place on May 22.

Looks like another disaster for Clegg:

http://news.sky.com/story/1236087/clegg-and-farage-go-toe-to-toe-in-eu-debate

Don't know how he is perceived in the UK, but I personally do not care for Clegg at all.  

This should be interesting to have UKIP elected?

Farage reminds me of Joe E Brown! I can't take him seriously. LL

Don't know about Farage LL.

IMO, it's a mistake not to take him seriously, LL.

He's not to my taste, too Right-wing and too much Union Jack-waving. He's irrelevant in Scotland - a couple of lost deposits and a police escort out of an Edinburgh pub are the limit of his impact here.

BUT....

He is speaking for an awful lot of people in England. People outside the UK may not be aware of the huge gulf that's opened up between ordinary people and their rulers - Farage rightly calls them a political elite.

The government is stuffed with toffs and clowns that have never done a day's work in their lives, laying down the law about how other people should live. They are squeezing the life out of people at the bottom, while enriching themselves from the public purse.

It is not going to take much for there to be an almighty explosion of rage in the not-very-united Kingdom.

I am a hybrid, bonny, and I dinna care one wee hoot about England and the English; I want to see Scotland sail away from the Union. But I dislike Farage as he is far too right wing for me. LL

Thing is, LL, we have a way out - and I hope to God we vote to take it, or I shudder to think what Westminster will do to Scotland.

England's only escape route is Farage and UKIP, and they are building up a fair head of steam now. Interesting times are ahead - the political elite are detested south of the border, too.

Also, Clegg is a tw@t of the first order, and should have known better than to take on Farage. From what I'm reading, he made a complete fool of himself.

Am looking forward to hearing more about this.   

I am glad I have dual nationality and an Austrian passport, because if things go pearshaped re Scotland's independence, I won't be renewing my current UK one in two years time.   LL

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/timstanley/100266038/farage-v-clegg-farage-won-easily-on-europe-his-argument-is-now-the-one-to-beat/

That's worth a read.

'You are wilfully lying to the British people': Farage warns European project will end 'very unpleasantly' after Clegg condemns Ukip's 'dangerous fantasy' about leaving EU
Farage says Britain would never opt to join the European Union today
Clegg insists if it sounds too good to be true, it is and Ukip peddle a 'con'
But row has erupted after Farage said he 'admires' Russian President Putin
MailOnline poll found 38% of people think Farage is a 'danger to Britain'
YouGov: Farage 68%, Clegg 27% - ICM: Farage 69, Clegg 31%


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2595391/Clegg-turn-fire-dangerous-Farage-admiring-Putin-defending-Assad-chemical-weapons.html#ixzz2xlSsopa3
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

A fuller report.

Before even looking at the DM link had to chuckle at row has erupted after Farage said he 'admires' Russian President Putin.

Never ever thought, as Bonny has too, that I would say I admire Putin over a Western leader.   

Clegg thinks like a child, unable to grasp that grown-ups can respect someone without greatly liking them.

If it hadn't been for Milward's intervention (and I'm still none too clear on what he actually did) and Putin, then the UK and US would not only have gone to war on yet another lie.

Our servicemen and women would be being killed and maimed to support Al Quaeda. That's without even mentioning the civilians who would have been killed by supposed smart bombs.

I'm not pretending the present situation is good, but it could have been much, much worse. And Muslim terrorists are currently wrecking an Armenian Christian town in Syria - don't those civilians merit any concern from Cameron and Obama?

I repeat, I'm no fan of Farage. BUT, he is saying what millions of ordinary English people are thinking, people who are being ignored by the political elite in Westminster.

It is, IMO, a recipe for disaster and unrest.

There appears to be outrageous contempt for the people who form the backbone of the country.

From Westminster, there most certainly is, Lily. And there is huge resentment building in England. I am forced to agree with Farage when he says there is great potential for unrest down South, which will probably erupt when Cameron is meddling in yet another country's business and ignoring his own.

That idiot Clegg is, do not forget, the deputy PM. Which is terrifying.

I do remember that Clegg is the deputy, Bonny.

What on earth is happening right now? Where are the great leaders of the West? Is Merkel considered to wear the crown there?

The movement away from acting in the best interests of the people they serve is stunning in its audacity. So the question becomes, who are they serving now if not the people?

Forgot to say, you must be hoping and praying that Scotland breaks away from this load of incompetent people.

I cannot think of a single Western 'leader' with anything resembling stature, every single one of them seems to be a weak, shifty liar intent only on feathering their own nest and helping their bankster chums profit. You know it's bad when Merkel looks like a statesman.

I am quietly confident we will break free, Lily, but I'm taking nothing for granted. If we don't, the Tories will use it as an excuse to hammer us into the ground if they can. Thankfully, the Edinburgh government is protecting us from the worst excesses and insanity from London.

I hope you do break free Bonny, but at least, your leader tries his best to protect you from the excesses of Westminster.

It seems to me that Merkel is the one looked up to. Although, I understand that most Germans are fed up to their back teeth of bailing countries out. Look at Hollande. His 75% tax was a great move as the people who fall into the bracket can up and leave any time they desire.

It's as though they want to financially break the people although if they do that, where will they turn?

They're so far removed from the grass roots, they just don't care. Nothing happens when one gets caught with his or her hand in the cookie jar, they just lie low for a bit and then get moved into a different job.

I suspect they've become so arrogant they think their gravy train will never end. And no-one in the UK signed up for the EU in its present forum. I did vote decades ago in that referendum - for the EU.

But at that time it was regarded as a trading bloc. Now, it's a bloated monster that seems to think its an empire, entitled to over rule the law of member states. It can't go on like this, IMO.

Yes, Bonny, I so agree with you. The Common Market was one thing and sounded so wonderful at the time. Expanding markets to trade goods. That was why people voted for it.

I seem to remember de Gaulle was so arrogant towards the UK. The British men were meant to be drinking wine and not beer etc. That went down well, didn't it?   

Oh, then Ted Heath and his er 50,000 GBP personal 'bonus' for joining? That was a long time ago.

There was no mention of what the real objective was because they would have known that it would not have been voted for.

The EU masters still use the sly tactics. Look at the Ukraine.

Anyway, may you keep out of this mess that will surely become something really nasty.

Mr Farage warned that the EU would break up 'very unpleasantly' if it did not end voluntarily.
He said: 'I want the EU to end, but I want it to end democratically. If it doesn't end democratically, I'm afraid it will end very unpleasantly.
'We are already in some countries beginning to see the rise of worrying political extremism. There's a neo-Nazi party in Greece that looks certain to win seats at the European Parliament.
'We see in Madrid, we see in Athens very large protests, tens of thousands of people, a lot of violence.
'I want the EU to end, but I want it to end democratically. If it doesn't end democratically, I'm afraid it will end very unpleasantly'
Ukip leader Nigel Farage
'If you take away from people their ability through the ballot box to change their future because they have given away control of everything to somebody else, I'm afraid they tend to resort to unpleasant means.'


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2595391/Clegg-turn-fire-dangerous-Farage-admiring-Putin-defending-Assad-chemical-weapons.html#ixzz2xlvuSr4n
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

He's right. Unfortunately, so many European politicians are busily rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic for their own benefit, they haven't deigned to notice the iceberg.

Never mind. I'm sure the IMF will be there to help.......

Ed Miliband last night demanded that Nigel Farage is barred from the leaders’ debates at next year’s General Election.
His call came the day after Ukip leader Mr Farage trounced Nick Clegg in a second debate on Europe.
A senior Tory source indicated that the Conservatives would also seek to block Mr Farage – even though the anti-EU party has been ahead of the Liberal Democrats in the opinion polls for months.
Mr Farage last night accused the two main parties of ‘running scared’


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2596470/Tories-Labour-scared-taking-says-Farage-Miliband-calls-UKIP-leader-banned-leaders-debates.html#ixzz2xuLLbAy6
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Yes, that's really going to impress English voters.

So, not only is Cameron scared of Alex Salmond. The entire Westminster political elite is scared of Farage.

Have they the foggiest idea what sort of message this sends out to the public - besides We're terrified.