Re: America goes to the polls

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 4:56 pm

I believe that you are correct in that for many people in the US they think Israel is like it was many years ago, Bonny. However, the Jewish population are still spiritually bound to Israel at the least and those bonds can be hard to break. Jewish people also tend to be highly intelligent as a group of people. Therefore, they can see reason.

Both in the US and in the ME, I know many people originally from Iran and every single one does not have good things to say about their homeland's leaders. Maybe things have changed in the last handful of years.

The best thing I heard in Netanyahu's speech, was that nuclear weapons must not be allowed to get into the hands of Muslim extremists (my words). I think that would be a massive fear to most people? They are crazy enough to not care what happens even to themselves.........

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/views/news/middle-east/2015/03/03/President-Obama-listen-to-Netanyahu-on-Iran.html

**bb1** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:08 pm

Yes, of course, that is the main fear of everyone, Lily. Trouble is, the Middle East is now such a tangled mess, it's well-nigh impossible to sort out who is on what 'side'. Iran has been fighting ISIS, and the current leadership does seem to be more or less sane.

IMO, Netenyahu is part of the problem in all this - he doesn't come over to me as balanced and reasonable, but as extremely aggressive and more than capable of using Israeli nuclear weapons unilaterally.

As I said earlier, it's one of these situations where I don't like anyone. And Obama is quite capable of shafting Israel because Netenyahu addressed Congress, then shafting Iran because they're the wrong kind of Muslim.

It's all too murky and unstable for my taste.

**Lamplighter** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:17 pm

Netenyahu is part of the problem in all this - he doesn't come over to me as balanced and reasonable, but as extremely aggressive and more than capable of using Israeli nuclear weapons unilaterally.

He is a fanatic and totally unhinged - remember Israel has nuclear weapons already, despite their denials, whereas Iran does not - yet. If Iran did get such weapons then Israel would not dare to use theirs as Iran would retaliate with full force. It's one hell of an impasse - might be solved by booting Netenyahu out of office and replace him with someone capable of seeing all sides of the conundrum. My Jewish friends want him gone now before he does go barmy and decide to use those weapons. LL

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:19 pm

I hear you, Bonny, and it is one big dreadful mess. Added to that toxic mess is the fact that the Pres is a person who cannot be trusted?

Personally, I also do not care for Netenyahu either.

Iran has enough oil to last for heaven knows how long. So, why does it need nuclear power? I wrestle with that one......

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:23 pm

Lamplighter wrote:
Netenyahu is part of the problem in all this - he doesn't come over to me as balanced and reasonable, but as extremely aggressive and more than capable of using Israeli nuclear weapons unilaterally.
He is a fanatic and totally unhinged - remember Israel has nuclear weapons already, despite their denials, whereas Iran does not - yet. If Iran did get such weapons then Israel would not dare to use theirs as Iran would retaliate with full force. It's one hell of an impasse - might be solved by booting Netenyahu out of office and replace him with someone capable of seeing all sides of the conundrum. My Jewish friends want him gone now before he does go barmy and decide to use those weapons. LL

I also understand where you are coming from, LL.

Netenyahu might be very unhinged but I think he knows very well what would happen if he unleashed them? Tit for tat? Who wins? That was why Russia and the US didn't use theirs and we had the Cold War?

**bb1** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:30 pm

It's one hell of an impasse - might be solved by booting Netenyahu out of office and replace him with someone capable of seeing all sides of the conundrum.

I won't pretend to understand Israeli politics, but just from looking at their online news, he seems to have split the country down the middle.

IMO, the best thing Israel could do to regain support in the wider world - is stop stealing people's land. How would you, or anyone else, feel, if that was done to you? Of course it angers Palestinians, how could it not?

**bb1** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:47 pm

Looks like Obama is going to have something to take his mind off Israel and Iran:

http://news.sky.com/story/1438702/justice-department-wont-charge-ferguson-cop

The US Justice Department has concluded the federal investigation into the fatal shooting of Michael Brown does not support civil rights charges against Ferguson police officer Darren Wilson.

Federal officials said there was no evidence to disprove Wilson's testimony that he feared for his safety.

They also found no reliable evidence that the unarmed black 18-year-old had his hands up when he was shot on 9 August 2014 in Ferguson, Missouri.

Wilson said the teen hit him in the face and reached for his gun during a tussle after he asked him to stop jaywalking.

The officer was cleared by a Missouri grand jury in November and later resigned from the department.

The report reads: "Based on this investigation, the Department has concluded that Darren Wilson's actions do not constitute prosecutable violations under the applicable federal criminal rights statute."

More follows...

Is it still too cold for riots?

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:54 pm

bb1 wrote: It's one hell of an impasse - might be solved by booting Netenyahu out of office and replace him with someone capable of seeing all sides of the conundrum.

I won't pretend to understand Israeli politics, but just from looking at their online news, he seems to have split the country down the middle.

IMO, the best thing Israel could do to regain support in the wider world - is stop stealing people's land. How would you, or anyone else, feel, if that was done to you? Of course it angers Palestinians, how could it not?

Well, he does have the election in a couple of weeks, so perhaps things will get better soon? I hope so too.

There is no question that they MUST stop stealing those lands. It is deeply disturbing for them to do that. Perhaps they will get a new guy who will get that to happen? Please......

**Lamplighter** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:54 pm

http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/03/the-central-question-is-it-1938/386716/

Over the years Benjamin Netanyahu has very explicitly said, "It's 1938 and Iran is Germany."

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:56 pm

I hope it is too cold, Bonny. There is another cold front set to hit this week too.

All this stirring from the top needs to stop.

**bb1** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:01 pm

All this stirring from the top needs to stop.

Yes, agree wholeheartedly. Everything from sh*t-stirring over dead thugs at home, to sh*t-stirring abroad, it needs to end now. It's caused nothing but trouble; I just can't remember a time when so many people - or governments - were at each other's throats, and one person seems to be right in the middle of all of it.

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:05 pm

Neville Chamberlain then, Barack Obama now

Don't think that is too bad a comparison out of that whole piece? A decent well armed military is surely a must in this world of increasing extreme violence?

As much as I do not like war - like the next person - we cannot be too weak either. We cannot stop the insanity by giving them hugs?

We are not that advanced yet......

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:10 pm

bb1 wrote:All this stirring from the top needs to stop.

Yes, agree wholeheartedly. Everything from sh*t-stirring over dead thugs at home, to sh*t-stirring abroad, it needs to end now. It's caused nothing but trouble; I just can't remember a time when so many people - or governments - were at each other's throats, and one person seems to be right in the middle of all of it.

He stirs like hell doesn't he? Than he retreats from all manner of things........

**bb1** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:14 pm

Problem is, it's Israel that's grabbing land for Lebensraum. Its neighbours could equally well make the case that THEY want nuclear weapons to keep the Israeli army out. Remember, Israel is drilling for oil under sections of the Golan Heights that are actually Syrian land.

Personally, I would say a fair solution is that Iran does NOT get nuclear-anything, and Israel gives the land it's grabbed since '67 back. This what I mean about not liking anyone that's involved in this, they're all in the wrong in one way or another........

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:36 pm

Bonny, I would applaud them giving the land back as would other people, I feel sure.

Much enmity might even end.

**Lamplighter** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:49 pm

lily wrote:Bonny, I would applaud them giving the land back as would other people, I feel sure.
Much enmity might even end.

They won't ever give it back, they believe it was God-given to the original Jews. They cite the Bible ad nauseum that the land belongs to The Chosen People. Of course the big laugh is that about 85% of the Jews in Israel are NOT descended from the original Israelites but from pagan or Christian tribes, many of whom were in Europe, that chose to convert to Judaism. LL

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:51 pm

I know that, LL. However, what about the remaining 15%? Just asking.....

**Lamplighter** Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:57 pm

lily wrote:I know that, LL. However, what about the remaining 15%? Just asking.....

The 15% are in fact what are called Oriental Jews and probably true descendents of the Israelites. These Jews, also known as Sephardi, were the British Jews before they were exiled in the 13th century and did not return until Oliver Cromwell's time. They have, however, been overtaken in numbers by the Aszkenazim who mainly come from Europe. There are some synagogues in the UK that are true Sephardic. LL

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:11 pm

Certain family members are Cohenim. This is a good link to explain it all.

http://www.aish.com/ci/sam/48936742.html

LL, I am exasperated by what is happening. I am.

**bb1** Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:14 pm

I think we all feel like that, Lily. The answer is there, but no-one is going to back down, and try to find a solution that is NOT at the end of a gun.

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:17 pm

Bonny, how true that is and let us not have the answer come about by more people having nuclear weapons......

**Lamplighter** Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:22 pm

lily wrote:Certain family members are Cohenim. This is a good link to explain it all.

http://www.aish.com/ci/sam/48936742.html

LL, I am exasperated by what is happening. I am.

Me too, on behalf of my Jewish friends. One of them is a Levi on his dad's side and Cohen on his mother's. As you have Cohanim fsmily members you would no doubt have recognised Mr Spock's hand sign, I did as one of my professors was a Cohen and I have been to temple with him a few times while at Oxford. LL

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:30 pm

Yes, LL, but it gives me great pleasure in Bennett just knowing somehow, that its a devil's sign. rofl

**Lamplighter** Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:33 pm

lily wrote: Yes, LL, but it gives me great pleasure in Bennett just knowing somehow, that its a devil's sign.

I knew exactly what you mean! hug

I found this, which proves that Israel does practice racism and discrimination. LL
http://www.irinnews.org/report/94819/israel-the-tribulations-of-being-an-ethiopian-jew

**lily** Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:38 pm

Of course, LL, and that is so sad. Crying or Very sad

They are, after all, known as the lost tribe.

Personally, I really do like the Golden Rule above all others.

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