Re: GADDIFI TOPPLED!!!!!TRIPOLI CELEBRATING!!!!!!!!

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:01 pm

Thanks, LL - I have cropped out the corpse on the right, in front of the other drain:

GADDIFI TOPPLED!!!!!TRIPOLI CELEBRATING!!!!!!!! - Page 32 Gaddaf10

I have just seen footage of his body being dragged through the streets, so I think we can take it he is dead.

ETA, apparently the writing on the tunnels says, This is the place where the rat was hiding.

**Lamplighter** Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:16 pm

What I find amazing is that people seem surprised he fled to Sirte. It was his home, where he grew up. Hitler went to Berlin, where he felt at home, when things went wrong; Saddam Hussein was found hiding in or very near to Tikrit, his home town. I do hope that the other dictators, Saleh and Assad, take due note that no-one is safe from the people. Remember Louis XVI? Charles I? Tsar Nicholas? There are examples throughout history. LL

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:48 pm

Cameron has just spoken to confirm that Gaddafi is dead.

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:53 pm

A couple of quotes from Cameron:

Cameron: Today is a day to remember all of Gaddafi's victims from Lockerbie to Yvonne Fletcher, and also IRA victims killed by Libyan semtex
by adamarnoldsky

Cameron: We should remember the many, many Libyans at the hands of this brutal dictator and his regime. #Gaddafi by adamarnoldsky

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:56 pm

http://news.sky.com/home/world-news/media-gallery/16093015

GADDIFI TOPPLED!!!!!TRIPOLI CELEBRATING!!!!!!!! - Page 32 16092994

Sky reporter Kitty Logan in the Libyan capital said: "The mood here in Tripoli is of absolute euphoria.

"This is the moment they have been waiting for, this is what their revolution was about and if the rumours are true this is closure for the Libyan people."

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:12 pm

GADDIFI TOPPLED!!!!!TRIPOLI CELEBRATING!!!!!!!! - Page 32 16093003

I don't know what they do to the enemy - but by God they frighten me! (c) Duke of Wellington

**crazytony** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:17 pm

Just coming in, Gaddafi was not killed by the coalition but by a Libyan freedom fighter.
Results of the Autopsy due at anytime now.

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:25 pm

Thanks, Tony - I freely admit I am getting lost trying to follow it all.

I wonder if the confusion has arisen because perhaps Gaddafi was fleeing the convoy which was hit when the rebels caught up with him? Something like that?

I suspect it will be a day or two before the picture is clear.

**lily** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:31 pm

Fantastic news.

**crazytony** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:32 pm

bb1 wrote:Thanks, Tony - I freely admit I am getting lost trying to follow it all.

I wonder if the confusion has arisen because perhaps Gaddafi was fleeing the convoy which was hit when the rebels caught up with him? Something like that?

I suspect it will be a day or two before the picture is clear.

I think that is, what happened Bonny. Now, because of the Muslim religion, they are rushing to discover the cause of death and to decide where to bury him. He may finish up the in the sea like Bin-Laden

**Lamplighter** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:35 pm

Al Jazeera:

Meanwhile, there were conflicting reports about the fate of one of his sons, Mutassim Gaddafi.

Reuters reported that one of the news agency's sources had seen video of Mutassim lying on a bed and covered in blood, but alive.

Mahmoud Shammam, the NTC's information minister, said he had received reports that Mutassim had been captured alive in Sirte, but could not confirm the news.

However, Mohamed Leith, an NTC commander, told the AFP news agency that Mutassim had been killed.

"We found him dead. We put his body and that of [former defence minister] Abu Bakr Younus in an ambulance to take them to Misrata".

Footage had emerged earlier in the day of the body of Younus.

Abdul Hakim Al Jalil, commander of the NTC's 11th brigade, said that Moussa Ibrahim, the former spokesman for Gaddafi's fallen government, had been captured near Sirte.

A thought: now that Gadaffi and his entourage are no more, is there a chance the Lockerbie bomber will tell the truth before he dies - or is he already dead? LL

**lily** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:39 pm

Thanks LL. I saw a heading about that but the article won't open for me.

**Lamplighter** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:48 pm

Al Jazeera:

3 min 25 sec ago

Al Jazeera's Tony Birtley reports from Sirte on ousted Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi's last stand in Sirte.

22 min 25 sec ago

With pictures of a dead Gaddafi circulating around 'martyr square,' Libyans celebrate the end of a brutal regime that they say affected all Libyans throughout the nation for 42 years.

Al Jazeera's James Bays reports live from Tripoli, where he got the reactions of some English-speaking Libyans.

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:52 pm

A thought: now that Gadaffi and his entourage are no more, is there a chance the Lockerbie bomber will tell the truth before he dies - or is he already dead? LL

He's still hanging on, LL, having bizarrely managed to outlive Gaddafi.

Jim Swire was on earlier; he is still hoping to find out more of the truth once the current chaos has quietened down a bit.

**lily** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:03 pm

Has there been any news about his son Saif?

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:06 pm

Apparently, Saif is on the run, somewhere in the desert, Lily.

**lily** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:10 pm

Thank you, Bonny. I do hope they get him as he is a chip off the block isn't he?

In the meantime, I thought this article is good.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/20/us-libya-gaddafi-trial-idUSTRE79J49320111020

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:19 pm

Yes, that is interesting...I don't actually see him being regarded as too much of a martyr, as it was at the hands of his own people, and NATO very much left operations on the ground up to Libyans.

Again, in an ideal world, he should have been put on trial - but how many more innocent people would lose their lives in the course of that?

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:30 pm

Oh Lord, footage of Gaddafi just before he died has emerged...what an ignominious end. I think it topped Mussolini, LL.

**lily** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:33 pm

There's been more than enough bloodshed over him, Bonny. It's probably better this way...........

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:37 pm

It looks as if he was shot 'resisting arrest', Lily, which while not desireable, is understandable, after what he did to his own people.

I suspect there are going to be some real horror stories coming out in the days to come.

**crazytony** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:45 pm

May God forgive me but, I am glad the barsteward is dead.

**Lamplighter** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:51 pm

bb1 wrote:Oh Lord, footage of Gaddafi just before he died has emerged...what an ignominious end. I think it topped Mussolini, LL.

As far as I remember, bonny, Mussolini and his mistress were shot before they were hung from the lamp-posts. From the video I saw, Gadaffi was alive when they started on him; looked like he was stamped on and kicked. But can you really blame them after what the Libyan people had suffered under his rule? I have no sympathy for him, I hope it was a very painful end. LL

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:59 pm

I don't blame them at all, LL, after the atrocities he has committed, on his own people and the wider world. It's not what happens in an ideal world, but no-one has the right to tell his victims, and fellow-Libyans, how they should have felt when they finally got hold of him.

Angry mobs are one of the hazards of being a despot.

**bb1** Thu Oct 20, 2011 6:15 pm

A Libyan minister is now saying Saif has been wounded, and is in hospital. His son Mutassim is rumoured to be dead.

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