Re: Military coup underway in Turkey

**bb1** Thu Jul 21, 2016 2:32 pm

Yes, it was secular, but it isn't now, and will only get worse. That's why I hoped the coup would succeed....it's been drifting into fundamentalism for some time.

**Lamplighter** Thu Jul 21, 2016 2:34 pm

bb1 wrote:Yes, it was secular, but it isn't now, and will only get worse. That's why I hoped the coup would succeed....it's been drifting into fundamentalism for some time.

But I thought you leant towards it being a put up job by Erdogan to finally seize full power? LL

**bb1** Thu Jul 21, 2016 2:46 pm

It can be both - genuine plotters who are then infiltrated and used to suit Edrogan's ends. Again, see Gunpower Plot.

**Lamplighter** Thu Jul 21, 2016 7:15 pm

Analysis: Is Turkish leader transforming a nation?
ISTANBUL (AP) — The stunning sweep of Turkey's crackdown following an attempted coup last week forces questions about how far President Recep Tayyip Erdogan will go in a tense, conspiracy-fueled country. While the purges may be designed to derail any future insurrections, there are increasing concerns that Erdogan is seizing the moment to transform Turkey, steering it from its secular roots toward a more pious Muslim model and cementing personal power at the expense of democratic ideals.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4493990-analysis-turkish-leader-transforming-nation.html#.1258-stage-hero1-1

The Latest: Videos show Turkey coup plotters shot protesters
ANKARA, Turkey (AP) — The Latest on the situation in Turkey after the failed military coup last week (all times local): 8:05 p.m. Videos have emerged of soldiers firing at large protests in Turkey during last weekend's failed coup.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4493036-latest-videos-turkey-coup-plotters-shot-protesters.html#.1258-stage-hero1-3

**lily** Thu Jul 21, 2016 7:24 pm

Not good.....

**bb1** Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:31 pm

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2016/07/20/women-being-silenced-turkeys-crackdown/87329486/

n the days after a failed military coup shook Turkey, women say they are being silenced.

From the start of the coup attempt by military officials on Friday through to the government’s crackdown in response, women’s voices have been almost entirely absent.

Images of protesters on the streets are mostly men. The military leadership is entirely male. The government is 85% men, with only one female minister. Currently, 43 cities don’t have any female representatives at all.

Publicly, the fact that mostly conservatives are holding vigils at the squares might be a factor in women’s absence, too. At least one religious group, namely the Ismailaga movement, issued a decree stating that they've decided the women will stay at home and pray while the men will go out to the streets to support the government.

Some women’s groups say they are being specifically targeted. On Twitter, many women talking about the coup attempt are reporting an increase in harassment on the streets. Others are railing against misogynist language used by all sides, reducing women to pawns, or spoils of war....etc.

Just what the world needed - the return of the Ottoman Empire.

**Lamplighter** Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:44 pm

The Latest: Group to Turkish govt: No rollback on rights
ANKARA, Turkey (AP) — The Latest on the situation in Turkey after the failed military coup last week (all times local): 10 p.m. Rights group Amnesty International says Turkey's decision to impose a state of emergency amid an intensive crackdown on the military, public sector and the media could pave the way for further rollbacks on human rights.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4493036-latest-group-to-turkish-govt-rollback-rights.html#.1258-stage-hero1-3

**bb1** Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:06 pm

Why does Amnesty think he's going to pay the slightest bit of attention to them - or anyone?

**Lamplighter** Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:14 pm

bb1 wrote:Why does Amnesty think he's going to pay the slightest bit of attention to them - or anyone?

Because the idiots at Amnesty labor under the delusion that the world listens to them when in fact the opposite is the norm. LL

**lily** Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:02 pm

Too true LL. thumbsup

**Lamplighter** Fri Jul 22, 2016 10:38 am

Nervous crowd blocks access to Turkish military base
ISTANBUL (AP) — A large crowd blocked access overnight to a Turkish military base in the capital amid nervousness following last week's failed coup attempt. The streets of Turkey's major cities were quiet Friday, a day after Turkish lawmakers approved a three-month state of emergency that allows the government to extend detention times and issue decrees without parliamentary approval.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4495844-nervous-crowd-blocks-access-to-turkish-military-ba.html#.1258-stage-hero1-1

**bb1** Fri Jul 22, 2016 10:47 am

Those recently targeted in the government crackdown include prominent journalist Orhan Kemal Cengiz and his wife, Sibel Hurtas, who were detained at Istanbul's main international airport as they prepared to leave the country Thursday. They were taken to police headquarters for questioning, the state-run Anadolu news agency reported.

This is just awful.

**Lamplighter** Fri Jul 22, 2016 3:47 pm

Turkey's state of emergency begins; critics fear overreach
ISTANBUL (AP) — Turkey's president triumphantly rallied supporters after prayers at a mosque Friday as his government announced new details about the state of emergency imposed after an attempted coup.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4495844-turkeys-emergency-begins-critics-fear-overreach.html#.1258-stage-hero1-1

Power restored to Incirlik air base in Turkey
ISTANBUL (AP) — The latest developments on the situation in Turkey after a failed military coup last week (all times local): 5:10 p.m. U.S. officials say electric power has been restored to the Incirlik air base in southern Turkey.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4496070-latest-power-restored-to-incirlik-air-base-turkey.html#.1258-stage-hero1-7

**Lamplighter** Fri Jul 22, 2016 6:21 pm

German Turkish community split by unrest after coup plot
Published: 22 Jul 2016 16:07 GMT+02:00
Hatred between supporters of President Recep Tayyip Erdogan and those opposed to him has exploded on social media in Germany in the wake of a failed coup attempt last Friday.
http://www.thelocal.de/20160722/tensions-in-germanys-turkish-community-grow-after-coup-plot

**bb1** Fri Jul 22, 2016 6:50 pm

Oh, wonderful. Perhaps it's time for them to consider returning to Turkey and fighting it out there?

**Lamplighter** Sat Jul 23, 2016 7:52 am

Cadets arrested in coup in Turkey were duped, relatives say

ISTANBUL (AP) — Military school cadets who were arrested following the failed coup in Turkey were unwitting participants because their commanders told them they would be attending a "surprise party" for the new head of the academy, relatives of the youths said Friday.
https://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4497116-cadets-arrested-coup-turkey-were-duped-relatives.html#.1272-stage-hero1-7

**lily** Sat Jul 23, 2016 5:21 pm

Some surprise that was then!

**bb1** Sat Jul 23, 2016 5:25 pm

Apologies, LL, I missed this post in the other mayhem....

I hope the cadets are released unharmed, and promptly - though I fear they won't, poor souls. They're nothing more than dupes.

**Lamplighter** Sat Jul 23, 2016 5:49 pm

Turkey seizes over 2,250 institutions in post-coup crackdown
ISTANBUL (AP) — In a new tactic against suspected coup plotters, Turkey on Saturday announced it had seized more than 2,250 social, educational or health care institutions and facilities that it claims pose a threat to national security.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4498176-turkey-seizes-2250-institutions-post-coup-crackdow.html#.1258-stage-hero1-7
^^^^^^THIS LINK HAS SUDDENLY CHANGED TO WHAT SEEMS TO BE ARABIC! However I found another version of it here: http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/turkey-seizes-over-2-250-institutions-in-post-coup-crackdown-1.2999389

8 Turks who fled to Greece are a diplomatic 'hot potato'
ATHENS, Greece (AP) — The Turkish military helicopter that landed in the Greek border city of Alexandroupolis just as an attempted coup was being quashed in Turkey has turned into one of the toughest diplomatic challenges to date for Greece's relatively inexperienced government.
http://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4498464-8-turks-who-fled-to-greece-diplomatic-hot-potato.html#.1258-stage-hero1-8

**Lamplighter** Sun Jul 24, 2016 8:23 am

Turkey detains top Gulen aide after coup attempt
Main aide to cleric blamed for a failed military coup attempt has been detained, after Gulen's nephew is also held.
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/07/turkey-detains-top-gulen-aide-coup-attempt-160723204559581.html

Presidential guard disbanded

Also on Saturday, Prime Minister Binali Yildirim said authorities would disband the elite presidential guard after detaining almost 300 of its members in the wake of the failed coup.

"There will no longer be a presidential guard, there is no purpose, there is no need," Yildirim said, speaking to A Haber channel.

The presidential guard is a regiment numbering up to 2,500 people, but at least 283 of its members had been detained after the attempted coup.

**bb1** Sun Jul 24, 2016 9:29 am

This is all very bad indeed.

**Lamplighter** Sun Jul 24, 2016 9:48 am

bb1 wrote:This is all very bad indeed.

Indeed. Earlier I referred to the SD purge by Hitlr in the 1930s, but now this is fast resembling the almost-succeeded attempt on his life by Von Stauffenberg and the army when they bombed the Wolfschanz. I think, if one assumed it isn't a false coup. then there is a good chance they got very close to Erdogen and he is now a very frightened nab and is lashing back against all and sundry. Or maybe it was set up to get his hands on Gulin and it went pear-shaped and now he is after everyone connected with the exiled cleric. Under Hitler’s orders, they were hung by nooses made from piano wire to ensure that they slowly strangled to death. But right before he would have died, Berthold was revived and then executed again, only to be revived and strangled again, at least a third and fourth time. And to really cap it off, all the executions were filmed so that Hitler could watch the torture-executions at his own pleasure. I wonder what is happening behind locked doors? How does one guess what goes on in a madman's mind? LL

**bb1** Sun Jul 24, 2016 9:57 am

Well, don't assume they're 'mad', LL. Erdogan's actions are perfectly logical - for someone that wants complete, absolute control of his country.

I often question whether Hitler was actually 'mad' - was invading the Soviet Union the act of a madman, or a gambler? If he hadn't done that, he could well have hung onto to Western and Central Europe for a very long time. His revenge for the July plot was indeed horrible - but it acheived the desired aim of quashing dissent.

I also question whether terrorists are 'mad' - to them, it's perfectly logical to commit attacks which horrify the rest of us because spreading terror is the object of the exercise.

I doubt if the rest of the world will do anything about Erdogan unless he starts invading his neighbours, a lot of noise will be made, and hot air expended. But actually do anything? No.

**Lamplighter** Sun Jul 24, 2016 10:16 am

I don't mean madness in the normal sense of the word. I mean in the sense of these people missing something in their makeup, ie what we call compassion. I have never considered Hitler as mad, but I do think after the attempt on his life he lost hos modus operandi - they got so close. In Erdogan's case I think he was frightened stiff and is now lashing out in every direction. But that doesn't work unless you wipe out the families of those you blame - you know, the old belief that you slaughter everyone then there are no relatives left to come after you. It's been done down the ages, the Caesars, despots like Ivan the Terrible, the Borgias, the Mafia .... LL

**bb1** Sun Jul 24, 2016 10:25 am

Ah yes, agree, LL! I don't know what it is that's missing in them, but something is - empathy, or compassion, as you say?

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