War in Ukraine

It's a betrayal of everything all those men died for on D-Day, Lily.

I watched Deadline Gallipoli. Horrible. Sorry, probably a different War.

Sabot wrote:I watched Deadline Gallipoli.  Horrible.  Sorry, probably a different War.

Yep, Gallipoli, WW1, D-Day, WW2. LL

Different war, but another shocker, Sabot, and the most appalling squandering of lives. As far as I am concerned, those responsible - including Churchill - should have been put on trial for treason for what happened there.

What did the British Empire think was going to happen when they tried to destroy Constantinople? Of course the Turks were going to fight back. Or when they deposited those poor men on the beaches at the foot of those cliffs, and left them, literally, to rot?

The Turks showed more compassion to injured Empire troops than their own commanders did. And it's worth remembering that the current wars in the Middle East have a great deal to do with how Britain acted after the Great War.

bb1 wrote:It's a betrayal of everything all those men died for on D-Day, Lily.

Precisely, Bonny.  It makes a person's blood boil to realize it.  

Life is so cheap isn't it except the lives of those doing it for their own ends.

It really upset me, Bonny. And I thought it was just The Trenches of Northern France that were a disgrace in World War One.

I had never actually heard about this before. No one in The Establishment has ever mentioned it. So why now?

Oh, I know. Someone made a film about it. Pull out the stops and let's honour so many forgotten men. Bunch of bloody hypocrites.

It's not the kind of thing the Establishment likes to talk about these days, Sabot, now they can no longer pretend all those poor men laid down their lives for the greater glory of King and Empire.

There was fighting everywhere, including East Africa:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_African_Campaign_%28World_War_I%29

Casualties[edit]
In Strachan's estimate of 2001, British losses in the East African campaign were 3,443 killed in action, 6,558 died of disease and c. 90,000 deaths among African porters.[45] In 2007 Paice recorded c. 22,000 British casualties in the East African campaign, of whom 11,189 died, 9% of the 126,972 troops in the campaign. By 1917 the conscription of c. 1,000,000 Africans as carriers, had depopulated many districts and c. 95,000 porters had died, among them 20% of the British Carrier Corps in East Africa.[46] A Colonial Office official wrote that the East African campaign had not become a scandal only ".... because the people who suffered most were the carriers - and after all, who cares about native carriers?"[47]

In the German colonies, no records of the number of people conscripted or casualties were kept but in the German Official History, Ludwig Boell (1951) wrote ".... of the loss of levies, carriers and boys [sic] [we could] make no overall count due to the absence of detailed sickness records."[47] Paice noted a 1989 estimate of 350,000 casualties and a death rate of 1:7 people. Carriers impressed by the Germans were rarely paid and food and cattle were stolen from civilians; a famine caused by the consequent food shortage and poor rains in 1917, led to another 300,000 civilian deaths in Ruanda, Urundi and German East Africa.[48] The impressment of farm labour in British East Africa, the failure of the rains at the end of 1917 and early 1918 led to famine and in September Spanish flu reached sub-Saharan Africa. In British East Africa 160,000–200,000 people died, in South Africa there were 250,000–350,000 deaths and in German East Africa 10–20 % of the population died of famine and disease; in sub-Saharan Africa, 1,500,000–2,000,000 people died in the epidemic.[49]

You don't hear too much about the death toll there, either...

Or how about what is now Iraq:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesopotamian_campaign

I am sure no-one will be surprised to know much of it was over the Mosul oilfields....

Barstewards.

Most of The Dead seem to have been shot by their own Officers. But let's not go into that.

I never did understand how a Volunteer could be shot for Cowardice because he refused to go to certain death. Surely at least they should have been given the benefit of the doubt. No?

My Dad was a Volunteer in the last War. A Chindit. Silly old bugger. Christ knows how he got across the Irrawady River when he couldn't even swim. One of the very few who survived that one. He never got in a bath of water from that day onwards. It was a family joke. Even when we actually had a proper bath.

Ho ho, such fun was Neasden in those days. I gather that it is all frightfully twee nowadays. The last time I got totally immersed in water was when I fell in The Feeder at the age of ten. Never even wanted to since.

PS. The Feeder was a side shoot of The River Brent which came from The Power Station. But it probably wasn't toxic.

Nothing much seemed to be toxic then, Sabot. As opposed to now, when the hysteria-prone imagine everything is toxic.....

bb1 wrote:Nothing much seemed to be toxic then, Sabot. As opposed to now, when the hysteria-prone imagine everything is toxic.....

Well, The Power Station was Coal Fired, Bonny. And actually not all that filthy. And I once fell in The River Brent on the end of a Rope Swing.

We did have some fun.

Kids were allowed to have fun then.  They weren't wrapped in cotton wool and told what they could and could not do by people who had no business to do so.  

http://rt.com/op-edge/258041-kerry-sochi-ukraine-fame/

Kerry in Sochi: Ukraine’s 15 minutes of fame is probably over

Bryan MacDonald is an Irish writer and commentator focusing on Russia and its hinterlands and international geo-politics. Follow him on Facebook



U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry (C) shakes hands with Russian President Vladimir Putin as U.S. Ambassador to Russia John Tefft (L) watches at the presidential residence of Bocharov Ruchey in Sochi, Russia May 12, 2015 (Reuters / Joshua Roberts)

I hope that take on the talks is correct, and for once, Kerry is doing something useful to thaw out relations.

Kerry was also careful to thank Putin for outlining his position in depth and to honor Russia’s war dead after Obama had snubbed the VE Day 70 celebrations in Moscow last weekend.

I don't think Obama's rudeness is EVER going to be forgotten in the world of grown-up diplomats and politicians; if he wouldn't go himself, he should have sent a representative. Mind you, Kerry's about the only one in the Obama administration that can be trusted not to eat his peas with a spoon.....

His rudeness was such an embarrassment to many people but hey, am thankful that someone stepped in to attempt to mend fences.

I do not forget that campaigning has begun for the next spot in the White House.

Oddly, that thought crossed my mind, too.....

Would it look good on a candidate's CV if he 'suddenly discovered' Ukraine had been taken over by neo-nazis? And that the US and Russia really should mend fences over this, what with Islamic terrorists being a threat to all of us?

....something like that, Bonny.   

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-05-14/mccain-joins-ukraine-advisory-committee-headed-georgias-fugitive-ex-president


McCain Joins Ukraine Advisory Committee Headed By Georgia's Fugitive Ex-President

Posing for photos with al-Nusrah, hanging around with neo-nazis - there's no beginning to McCain's concern for humanity.

I wonder just how many innocent people have died because of him?

Grrrrrr.

Moscow Admits Two Fighters Captured in Ukraine Are Ex-Russian Soldiers

• By Anna Dolgov
  
• May. 19 2015 09:34
  
• Last edited 09:36
  

ReutersA Ukrainian military commander shows off a rifle taken from a captured Russian soldier at a press conference on Monday.

Russia's Defense Ministry has identified two fighters captured in Ukraine as former servicemen in the Russian military — a concession that echoes rights advocates' claims that Moscow has been discharging its soldiers from the army before sending them to fight alongside separatists in the Donbass.
The fighters, Alexander Alexandrov and Yevgeny Yerofeyev, whom Ukrainian forces captured in the rebel-controlled Luhansk region, "were not active servicemen in the Russian armed forces at the moment of their capture on May 17," Russian Defense Ministry spokesman Igor Konashenkov said Monday.
However, "we have checked up on the information of the Ukrainian side — these boys previously have in fact served in one of the Russian military units and have military training," Konashenkov said, according to comments carried by Russia's major state-run news agencies.
It remained unclear when the men might have been discharged from the Russian military. Separatists in Luhansk claimed that the fighters were serving in rebel "militia" and have released photos of their rebel-issued military IDs, both dated this year.
Ukraine has identified the fighters as officers from the GRU, the foreign military intelligence branch of Russia's army, and released a video with the men saying they had been part of a Russian special forces spying mission. In the video, which could not be independently verified, Alexandrov also says that his group has been in eastern Ukraine since earlier this year.
Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov, asked to comment, said: "Both we and the Defense Ministry have said multiple times that there are no Russian servicemen in the Donbass."

Russian President Vladimir Putin has also repeatedly denied the presence of Russian troops in Ukraine.
"I am telling you openly and unambiguously: There are no Russian troops in Ukraine," Putin said during his annual televised call-in show last month.
Putin had also denied the presence of Russian troops in Crimea ahead of Moscow's annexation of the peninsula from Ukraine in March 2014 only to acknowledge it afterward.
The Defense Ministry's latest claim about the identity of the Russian fighters jibes with an account provided in a report released last week by allies of murdered opposition leader Boris Nemtsov.
Based on interviews with Russian troops and their representatives, the report claims that this year, Moscow started discharging its soldiers from the army before sending them to Ukraine and then declining military benefits to the families of soldiers who were killed in the conflict.
The practice marked a shift from Moscow's alleged handling of the fighting in Ukraine last year, when Russia deployed active servicemen across the border, the report said. At that time, soldiers' families received military benefits in exchange for keeping silent about the circumstances in which their loved ones died, the report said.
Ukraine intends to prosecute the captured fighters for "terrorist acts," the head of Ukraine's Security Service, Valentyn Nalyvaichenko, said Monday.
Ukrainian Interior Ministry adviser Anton Gerashchenko has suggested that after the men stand trial, they could be exchanged for Ukrainian pilot Nadezhda Savchenko, who is currently in prison in Moscow, as well as another 400 Ukrainian prisoners held by Russia.
The Russian Defense Ministry is "counting on" Ukraine to free the two fighters, its spokesman said, TASS news agency reported.

At least they aren't American and Polish mercenaries slaughtering civilians in Donbass for shit, giggles and money. Or neo-nazis enjoying killing 'Colorado beetles' because they regard Russian-speaking Ukrainians as sub-human. My, how they laughed when they burned all those poor people alive in Odessa.

I hope there are a LOT of ex-Russian troops in Donbass; they are helping stop a genocide. Good for them, standing up for their Ukrainian cousins.

Anyway, it looks as if a couple of former Russian military are about to be the least of Porky's troubles; he CANNOT repay the latest bunch of loans that are about to fall due without reducing what's left of Ukraine to near-medieval conditions, and selling off absolutely everything, including people's homes.

He'll be lucky if he can escape to be reunited with his offshore bank account before his infuriated subjects introduce him to a rope and a lamppost.

A bit more about these two men:

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/russia-daily-brief-for-may-20-2015.html

Judging the videos, those don't appear to be interrogations, but rather written statements read in front of the camera, with an occasional prompt from the "interrogator." These two are most likely former Russian servicemembers who came to the Donbass as volunteers, and they read the statements that were placed in front of them because the alternative was being tried on terrorism charges. One wonders whether they might be under the influence of drugs of some sort, judging by their rather listless behavior.

Captured Russian volunteers were tortured



LifeNews points out that the cast on Yerofeyev's arm appeared later, and does not appear to have anything to do with his combat wound which he sustained to the opposite shoulder.

 The propagandists' misstep



Oh look, there was nothing wrong with his left arm until he was introduced to the SBU, who are notorious for having ways of making prisoners talk.

Lots of interesting links here:

https://www.facebook.com/supportdonetsk

including material that is never published in Western media, because it spoils the fantasy about our Gallant Allies in Kiev. They haven't managed to censor the internet - yet.

http://21stcenturywire.com/2014/11/17/natos-nazis-ethnic-cleansing-their-opposition-in-east-ukraine/

http://www.globalresearch.ca/america-cleanses-southeastern-ukraine-of-ethnic-russians/5388101


*WARNING*

The photos of the atrocities committed by the Kiev forces, neo-nazis and Western mercenaries have NOT been blurred on those links.

http://rt.com/news/260905-clashes-fire-kiev-protest/

Clashes, tires on fire outside Ukrainian parliament in Kiev

[live feed of riot]

Clashes are reported in central Kiev where crowds of protesters are rallying against the economic crisis and the soaring cost of private loans. Local media say several people have tried to break into the Ukrainian parliament.

The protesters have clashed with police and blocked the entrances to the parliament building.

The so-called "Financial Maidan" crowd is demanding that the parliament approves the law on restructuring private loans in foreign currency, which would convert people's debts into national currency at pre-crisis levels.

The protesters have set fire to car tires and attempted to break into the Parliament building. Riot police have so far been able to hold them back.



RT ✔@RT_com
BREAKING: Clashes, tires on fire outside Ukrainian parliament in Kiev (LIVE FEED) http://on.rt.com/8tdcih

Life News however reports several activists did manage to get into the building, spreading banners with their demands and shouting in approval of those deputies that voted for the restructuring bill.

Earlier, the parliament failed to approve the second reading of a law that would allow borrowers to pay their loans back in hryvnas, at a rate of about 5 hryvnas to the dollar. The current exchange rate is about 20 hryvnas to the dollar, as Ukraine faces a deep financial crisis. The bill will now go through one more reading in the parliament.

Several MPs have tried to calm the crowd down. Borislav Bereza from the Right Sector ultranationalist party told the crowds "the situation [with the law] was manipulated."

The "Financial Maidan" movement has been active for several months in Kiev, with demonstrations near the Parliament and the National Bank. Their demands include refunds for those with deposits in banks hit worst by the crisis.

They also demand resignation of the country's Prime Minister Arseny Yatsenyuk and Finance Minister Natalya Yaresko.

At least 11 "Financial Maidan" activists were into their fourth day of a hunger strike next to the Parliament building Thursday. One of them has been taken to hospital.

Among the slogans the protesters are shouting is the infamous "Out with the gang!" heard numerous times during the 2013-14 Maidan uprising against President Yanukovich and his government, which eventually brought the current officials to power.

Wonder where that woman with the bags of cookies has got to?

http://www.infowars.com/video-us-backed-ukrainian-militants-hang-pregnant-woman/

VIDEO: US-BACKED UKRAINIAN MILITANTS HANG PREGNANT WOMAN
US Army currently training pro-Kiev neo-nazi fighters

by PAUL JOSEPH WATSON | MAY 22, 2015

A shocking video shows US-backed militants in Ukraine hanging a pregnant woman and her husband, yet more evidence of atrocities being committed by pro-Kiev forces.



Last month we reported on a video that showed Ukrainian neo-nazi militia fighters carrying out an ISIS-style execution during which they nail a separatist rebel to a cross and then burn him alive.

The brutal murder was reportedly carried out by members of the Azov Battalion, which was converted into a regiment last year, making it a de facto part of the Ukrainian Army.

Despite the militants being implicated in war crimes and fascist ideology, U.S. troops from the 173rd Airborne Brigade arrived at the Yavoriv training ground in Lviv last month to work with Ukrainian national guard battalions.

F.U.C.K. Sorry. Can't think of anything else to say.

The neo-nazi scum enjoy doing things like that, recording their atrocities and posting them on the internet. They've posted worse than that, believe it or not.

And it's EU and US taxpayers' money that is making it all possible.