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Death in the Middle East

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Death in the Middle East - Page 9 Empty Re: Death in the Middle East

Post  bb1 Sat Jul 19, 2014 10:10 pm

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2014/07/thousands-europe-rally-palestinians-2014719191611983924.html

Thousands of pro-Palestinian protesters have marched across Europe, calling on their governments to condemn Israel's military bombardment of Gaza.

While several thousand people marched in a peaceful protest in London on Saturday, a demonstration in northern Paris turned violent when protesters, defying a ban on their planned rally, clashed with riot police.


INTERACTIVE: Gaza Under Attack
The ban on Paris and Nice protests could not stop the hundreds who turned out in the French capital from clashing with police, who fired tear-gas canisters and stun grenades at demonstrators who had launched projectiles.

The demonstrators also climbed on top of a building and burned an Israeli flag. At least one car was set on fire.


You never seem to get demos like that in the US, Lily. I suspect a few hardened European rioters would scare Obama witless.
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Post  lily Sat Jul 19, 2014 10:27 pm

....Indeed, Bonny.
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Post  Lamplighter Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:05 am

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2014/07/toll-mounts-as-israel-shells-northern-gaza-201471917958481424.html

Toll mounts as Israel shells northern Gaza
Death toll passes 360 after Israeli tanks bombard Palestinian enclave throughout the night.
Last updated: 20 Jul 2014 06:36

The death toll in Israel's assault on the Gaza Strip passed 360 as the territory was bombarded throughout the night by the heaviest barrage of tank shells since the beginning of the offensive twelve days ago.

Thirty-one bodies were brought to hospitals on Sunday morning, medics told Al Jazeera, and the number was expected to rise as ambulances were able to reach neigbhourhoods east of Gaza City.

Hundreds of people who had been trapped by overnight bombardment were entering Gaza City on foot in the morning as shelling could still be heard, Al Jazeera's Stefanie Dekker reported.

Israel announced on Saturday that four of its soldiers were killed in combat with Palestinian fighters, bringing the total death toll on the Israeli side to seven.

Al Jazeera's John Hendren, reporting from Jerusalem, said two soldiers were killed during an exchange of gunfire as they fought Palestinians in tunnels near the Israel-Gaza border.

A Palestinian fighter was also killed while several others escaped back into a tunnel into Gaza, our correspondent said.

Earlier on Saturday, an Israeli Bedouin was killed when a rocket hit his encampment in southern Israel in an attack which also wounded four of his family, among them two young children, police said.

Israel began its offensive with air strikes on July 8 in response to rocket fire from Gaza. It says Hamas military installations are being targeted, but an overwhelming majority of those killed and injured have been civilians.

While shelling focused on northern Gaza on Saturday, heavy Israeli artillery attacks also took place across other areas of the Hamas-ruled territory. Drones, jets and attack helicopters patrolled the skies.

Aid convoy blocked

In another development on Saturday, agencies said Egyptian soldiers in north Sinai prevented an aid convoy of activists from reaching the Rafah border crossing with the Gaza Strip.

An army officer at the Balloza checkpoint, one of many along the desert highway to Rafah, told an AFP correspondent that the security situation in the peninsula was too unstable to allow the convoy of 11 buses and 500 activists to pass.

There was a brief scuffle between some activists and soldiers but no arrests were made.

Egypt usually keeps the crossing closed, citing a counterinsurgency operation against fighters in north Sinai, but has allowed entry to Palestinians wounded in the 12-day conflict between Hamas and Israel.

The Egyptian military had earlier said it was sending 500 tonnes of food and medical aid to Gaza.

Hamas has refused to accept a ceasefire with Israel until it receives guarantees that border crossings to Gaza - all but one under Israeli control - will be opened.

Success 'not guaranteed'

The ground offensive is a new phase in Israel's Operation Protective Edge operation which the military said would destroy tunnels used by Hamas.

Benjamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, said the ground operation was necessary to deal with the tunnels, but admitted there was "no guarantee of 100 percent success".
Gaza residents testify about the effects Israel and Egypt's blockade of their land has had on their lives.

The offensive failed to prevent an incursion by a tunnel into Israel by Qassam Brigades fighter on Friday. The attack was foiled by the Israeli military, however, with one fighter killed.

On the diplomatic front, the Palestinian and Israeli UN ambassadors traded blame for the violence, with Israel's Ron Prosor insisting no other country would "tolerate ... terrorist" rocket fire at its citizens.

Meanwhile, Qatar will host a meeting between Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas and UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon on Sunday to try to reach a ceasefire agreement with Israel.

Due to take place in Doha, the meeting will be headed by the Gulf state's emir, Sheikh Tamim bin Hamad Al Thani, who has been acting as a "channel of communication" between Hamas and the international community, a senior source familiar with the matter told Reuters news agency.

"Qatar has presented Hamas' requests to the international community, the list has been presented to France and to the UN, the talks tomorrow will be to further negotiate these conditions."

A UN statement said Ban will be travelling to Doha, Kuwait City, Cairo, Jerusalem, Ramallah and Amman and that other stops might be added.

Ban would help Israelis and Palestinians "in coordination with regional and international actors, end the violence and find a way forward," Jeffrey Feltman, UN under secretary-general for political affairs, told the Security Council.

Gaza 360 dead and rising: Israhell 7 LL  Sad 
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 12:08 pm

Benjamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, said the ground operation was necessary to deal with the tunnels, but admitted there was "no guarantee of 100 percent success".

I can't help suspecting that Israel nowadays is great at bombing civilians from a distance, but not quite so good at fighting on the ground.

I hope something comes of the peace talks this time, and that Qatar is playing with clean hands.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2014/07/us-strikes-11bn-arms-deal-with-qatar-2014714223825417442.html

Death in the Middle East - Page 9 2014714225128626580_20

The deal was signed at the Pentagon by US Defence Secretary Chuck Hagel and his Qatari counterpart [AFP]
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Post  Sabot Sun Jul 20, 2014 12:23 pm

Tunnels? So these people are tunnelling their way into a Kibutz or two to kill the inhabitants?

Why don't they just leave The Jews alone? Palestine has never done anything to help itself. It is The Jews who supply Health Care to these people.

So, the reason for the fight has been lost in the mists of time. But I remember. The Palestinians hate Jews.
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:10 pm

How would you feel about someone that kicked you out of your home and off your land, Sabot?

None of this is black and white, good guys v bad guys, us v them.
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Post  Sabot Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:33 pm

bb1 wrote:How would you feel about someone that kicked you out of your home and off your land, Sabot?

None of this is black and white, good guys v bad guys, us v them.

How would you feel about these people raining bombs on your head from a great height , Bonny?

But I am bailing out now. There is no answer. I am just Pro Jewish after watching my stepmother, ghastly old cow, living in fear for her and her son, my half brother.
And the inevitable effect it had on her and how she dealt with my sister and me. The poor ghastly old cow was permanently terrified.
Nothing to forgive. Just bloody awful.
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:38 pm

There's a difference between supporting persecuted Jews, and supporting Zionism, Sabot. The latest death toll is 350 Palestinians, 70 of whom were children, versus 7 Israelis, the bulk of which were military.
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:40 pm



Israeli audience cheering bombing of Gaza.
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Post  Sabot Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:54 pm

bb1 wrote:There's a difference between supporting persecuted Jews, and supporting Zionism, Sabot. The latest death toll is 350 Palestinians, 70 of whom were children, versus 7 Israelis, the bulk of which were military.

I can't answer that, Bonny. And I don't even want to try. It all grieves me. Enough to have me half in tears.
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:19 pm

That's it, Sabot, there is no all good and all bad. But my sympathies are always with innocent civilians caught in the middle of messes started by warmongering politicians, whoever those politicians are, whether they are on 'our side' or not.
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Post  Sabot Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:30 pm

bb1 wrote:That's it, Sabot, there is no all good and all bad. But my sympathies are always with innocent civilians caught in the middle of messes started by warmongering politicians, whoever those politicians are, whether they are on 'our side' or not.

Look to Britain, Bonny. What they did to The Jews who were trying to escape The Shoa will forever remain indefensible.
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:44 pm

Perfect example, Sabot. Britain has done just as many - possibly more - sh*tty things as any other large nation, but somehow a fair section of the public manages to fool itself that our 'side' is always right.

You could make the argument that if more large nations had opened their doors to Jewish refugees in the thirties, then there would not have been such a call for a Jewish state, and we wouldn't be where we are now. And a fair bit of the current mess in the Middle East is the direct consequence of Imperial British meddling and drawing arbitrary national boundaries.
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Post  Sabot Sun Jul 20, 2014 3:07 pm

bb1 wrote:Perfect example, Sabot. Britain has done just as many - possibly more - sh*tty things as any other large nation, but somehow a fair section of the public manages to fool itself that our 'side' is always right.

You could make the argument that if more large nations had opened their doors to Jewish refugees in the thirties, then there would not have been such a call for a Jewish state, and we wouldn't be where we are now. And a fair bit of the current mess in the Middle East is the direct consequence of Imperial British meddling and drawing arbitrary national boundaries.

Thank you, Bonny. That is where I start from. And always will. No one did anything much to help these people who were being slaughtered wholesale, even before the War. Six F*CKING Million. How many does anyone want?
My stepmother was just a passing residual.

But it is no longer possible for me to comment on what is happening now because I don't bloody well live in Israel. But if I did then I know what I would be doing.
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Post  lily Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:06 pm

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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:39 pm

Good God! I know there have been a few demos, but storming embassies isn't really on.....
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:43 pm

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Post  lily Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:46 pm

This could spread elsewhere?
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Post  Lamplighter Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:52 pm

bb1 wrote:Good God! I know there have been a few demos, but storming embassies isn't really on.....
The Turks do not forget the Israeli storming of the Turkish ship carrying relief goods to Gaza or the deaths of some of the activists during the raid.   LL


Last edited by Lamplighter on Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:56 pm

It isn't good, Lily, there are too many angry people in the world just now.

There isn't a non-ghoulish way of putting this, but today's death toll so far - 90 dead Palestinians, almost all civilians, and 13 dead Israeli soldiers may well be confirming something first noticed after the Lebanon war. That Israel isn't actually all that good at fighting ground wars these days. Israel has got into the habit of wiping out Palestinians with no losses to itself.

I wish they would hold genuine peace talks - telling Hamas to lay down its arms without lifting the blockade, etc., is never going to work.

That's a very good point, LL - storming those aid ships was nothing better than piracy.
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:57 pm

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Post  lily Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:00 pm

No it isn't good, Bonny.

There are reports of demonstrations where both Jews and Palestinian people are walking together in Israel.

This is a very interesting piece. I wish for them that the world listens and takes action.

http://countercurrentnews.com/2014/07/why-israelis-and-palestinians-both-must-read-this-gaza-youth-manifesto/
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Post  Lamplighter Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:02 pm

On TV today Netanyahu made a point of profusely thanking the US for all its help over the years, and for it making sure Israel could deal with its enemies as it saw fit. LL
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Post  bb1 Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:08 pm

I wonder how long Plucky Little Israel would last without US money and military aid? It's very easy to be 'brave' when you're bombing civilians from the safety of a bunker, or a gunship.
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Post  Lamplighter Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:10 pm

bb1 wrote:I wonder how long Plucky Little Israel would last without US money and military aid? It's very easy to be 'brave' when you're bombing civilians from the safety of a bunker, or a gunship.
No wonder Israel wants the US to ensure Iran doesn't get nuclear capacity. It would change the status quo to something else. LL
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