Re: Breaking News!!!! Richard III's Body Found!

**lily** Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:36 pm

It's her title, LL? Dr.......

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:39 pm

lily wrote:It's her title, LL? Dr.......

This is her, lily. LL

http://www.bgs.ac.uk/staff/profiles/5796.html

**bb1** Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:39 pm

Yes, that is odd. I could see the point if there was, say, a mineral specific to one area found in his bones, but I don't quite see what relevance it has to the eating habits of medieval monarchs....

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:47 pm

bb1 wrote:Yes, that is odd. I could see the point if there was, say, a mineral specific to one area found in his bones, but I don't quite see what relevance it has to the eating habits of medieval monarchs....

Didn't the commentator say she had helped the police in murder cases? Surely there are specialists with her knowledge who also know about the Middle Ages? Also I am afraid I found her voice squeaky and rather irritating; as I have hearing problems I have enhanced equipment re speech so maybe it was that making her sound weird. If she showed some knowledge about medieval times that might have made her more credible. LL

**bb1** Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:58 pm

No, it wasn't you, LL, I have the opposite problem, I am very sensitive to unpleasant noise - tinny music drives me up the wall, for instance. She did have an annoying voice.

I would have been happy to see an hour about Dominic, and the 'science' in a totally separate programme.

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:05 pm

bb1 wrote:No, it wasn't you, LL, I have the opposite problem, I am very sensitive to unpleasant noise - tinny music drives me up the wall, for instance. She did have an annoying voice.

I would have been happy to see an hour about Dominic, and the 'science' in a totally separate programme.

Thanks bonny! I am thinking the producers maybe realized the paucity of proof re the scientific bit and decided to 'ride it' on the back of the Dominic segment - excuse the pun! LL

**bb1** Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:18 pm

Very possibly, LL, he was wonderful. I loved the scene where his riding instructor was worried because he had such trouble on the modern saddle, then he changed to a proper medieval saddle and there was no holding him. And that was a BIG horse.

I should think he's going to be very popular at this year's Bosworth re-enactment, and hopefully will be promoted from being a Scribe.

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:35 pm

http://www.leics.gov.uk/m0898_battlefield_mail_spring_2014_webaw_110214.pdf

http://www.bosworthbattlefield.com/

I have ridden a horse with a medieval saddle and it was very comfortable - one's bits are very comfortable and the back rest bit is good. I always wondered why Richard seemed to prefer fighting on horseback; that reconstruction with Dominic certainly showed how Richard managed. I assume that when he was unhorsed at Bosworth his demise was inevitable, as Dominic said he tired quite quickly when on his feet in the armor. LL

**bb1** Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:52 pm

It's a great pity he made that headlong chivalric charge, instead of doing something Bruce-ish and sneaky, like trapping Tudor in the boggy ground. Preferably with spikes.

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:01 pm

bb1 wrote:It's a great pity he made that headlong chivalric charge, instead of doing something Bruce-ish and sneaky, like trapping Tudor in the boggy ground. Preferably with spikes.

Somehow I don't think Richard would have known how to be sneaky, he seemed to have been what Chaucer called a 'perfect, gentle knight'. Devious seems to have been a state of mind for Edward and George, but somewhere that gene seemed to have passed him by. Not boggy, it was high summer. This Friday, by the way, is the 529th anniversary of the battle. LL

**lily** Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:03 pm

Like it...... biggrin

**bb1** Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:12 pm

Well, something Machiavellian then, like having H7 poisoned/stabbed when he was still in France. He'd have been doing the world a favour.

**lily** Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:44 pm

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:55 pm

bb1 wrote:Well, something Machiavellian then, like having H7 poisoned/stabbed when he was still in France. He'd have been doing the world a favour.

If it was Edward, yes, but not Richard. What we know of his character, he was upfront. He refused, for instance, money from the French after the signing of the Treaty of Picquigny, though he did attend the celebrations - probably either requested or ordered to by Edward. Read the link below and see who got cash from the French King - in other words who accepted bribes. LL

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Picquigny

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 6:52 pm

Further to the Picquigny affair, quite a few Ricardians believe that the reason why Louis of France secretely financed henry Tudor was because he felt he had been insulted by Richard when his obvious bribes were refused. Also Richard was very much in favor of 'doing a Henry V' to France, an invasion and the return of the French crown to England - H6 had incompetently managed to 'lose' it. Had Louis not backed H Tudor he wouldn't have stood a chance against the military abilities of Richard. Richard was one hell of a danger to Louis who was not at all soldierly, his nickname was 'The Spider King' as he would sit in his castle and weave webs of conspiracy against anyone he feared. LL

**bb1** Mon Aug 18, 2014 7:30 pm

That sounds very feasible, LL, H7 was no threat to anyone militarily, as far as I can make out?

**Lamplighter** Mon Aug 18, 2014 7:37 pm

bb1 wrote:That sounds very feasible, LL, H7 was no threat to anyone militarily, as far as I can make out?

H7 spent most of his life on the run, he had no trainng in warfare as Richard had, he was after all a nonentity, a double b*stard. Minor nobility, nothing more, in fact one of his immediate ancestors was a butler in a Welsh castle. LL

**Lamplighter** Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:03 am

529th anniversary of Bosworth. Rest in Peace, Your Grace and also the many brave men who died with you on this sad day and the ones who were judicially murdered over many years. Lamplighter

**bb1** Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:25 am

I've come to realise it was a sad day for England, and the wider world, when Richard was killed, LL. It's odd, though, some kind of folk memory of him must have survived all these years, that his discovery sparked such an outpouring of emotion.

In the end, Richard has won, you know. H7 is already just a footnote in history, but Richard is never going to be forgotten. People all over the world, in countries he didn't know even existed, are honouring him. Who would have imagined such a thing was possible a few years ago? And don't ask me to explain it, I can't, but there's just something about King Richard that touches people.

**Sabot** Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:33 am

I must admit that I knew absolutely nothing about Henry the VII, except that I supposed he was the father of Henry the VIII. Now I know about his mother I am not at all surprised by how awful The Tudors were.

**Lamplighter** Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:34 am

The first rebuttal of the Tudor version of Richard's life was published in 1646, as I recall. After that the versions grew and grew, with many pros and antis (sounds familiar?) screeching at each other over the centuries. The Richard lll Society, originally The Fellowship of the White Boar has been in existence since 1924. LL

**Lamplighter** Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:24 pm

529th anniversary of Battle of Bosworth remembered

By dan j martin | Posted: August 22, 2014

The 529th anniversary of the death of Richard III has been marked today.

Events were held both where England’s last Plantagenet king died in combat at Bosworth Field and at the cathedral in Leicester where his remains are to be re-interred next year, near where they were discovered under a council car park.

Members of the Richard III Society were joined civic dignitaries at a service and rose-laying ceremony at the battlefield where they remembered the king and the 1,000 or so soldiers who lost their lives fighting for him or his rival Henry Tudor.

Re-enactors dress as knights led a procession and stood guard as 50 red roses and 50 white roses were lain to pay tribute to the warring houses of York and Lancaster.

The battle in 1485 was the final clash in the Wars of the Roses and saw Henry Tudor claim Richard’s crown.

Bishop of Leicester, the Right Reverend Tim Stevens led the event at Bosworth then an evensong at Leicester Cathedral.

More than 100 civic dignitaries gathered in the historic church, under scaffolding where major building work is being carried out to accommodate Richard’s tomb.

He will be interred in the spring.

Leicestershire County council chairman councillor Bill Boulter attended both events.

He said: "It was a very poignant occasion at the battlefield as we remembered those who lost their lives.

“We wanted to reflect on their place in history with honour and dignity.

“The cathedral service was very nice. It was good to see the new Cathedral Gardens looking wonderful

“This is a very fitting place to lay Richard to rest.”

Lord Mayor of Leicester councillor John Thomas said: “It is important we mark this occasion especially now because we know Richard will have a huge impact on this city in the future.

“We have already seen some major improvements which probably would not have happened had he not been rediscovered.”

Prayers were said at the cathedral both for those slain at Bosworth more than 100 years ago and for those who have died recently in fighting in Iraq and Syria.

Cathedral guests were invited to view the progress on the work to prepare the building for the king.

Clergy are seeking to raise £2.5 million for the re-interment project.

Read more at http://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/529th-anniversary-Battle-Bosworth-remembered/story-22807178-detail/story.html#KtU7AMGfVzvdvrM7.99

**Sabot** Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:49 pm

Tis a strange story. The Plantagenets originated in France, and until now I have always been much more interested in their beginnings rather than their endings. In fact Henry the Second was the first of The Plantagenets. I know this due to reading too much Brother Caedphile. But they are wonderful stories. And the only bit of history that really grabbed me.

Richard? I honestly don't know how I feel about him, except Rest in Peace. But he was probably doing that anyway, until they dug him up.
The Tudors are a different story.

**lily** Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:00 pm

Have found all the events fascinating and I appreciate all the facts put on this thread. smile

**Sabot** Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:10 pm

I might take a Degree in History one day. If I have the time. I always wanted to be a Barrister.

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