Re: Hungary is new hot spot on migrant route into EU - Part 2

**Lamplighter** Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:53 am

bb1 wrote:Ah, so it was indeed a bomb? I saw a lot of chatter about whether it was a bomb or a simple, if unpleasant, gas leak.

A nail fragnmentation bomb, my sources tell me. I know that area very well, busy part of the city. LL

**bb1** Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:12 am

Thanks for accurate information, LL, always appreciated!

The Express is prone to over-excitement at the best of times, but nowadays, a lot of these stories come from people posting on Twitter, which isn't always the most accurate source of news...

One person may report 'an explosion', which is factual and correct, but others will tweet about anything from a straightforward gas cylinder exploding accidentally to full-on deliberate carnage.

**lily** Mon Sep 26, 2016 4:02 pm

Oh my, that is terrible. Crying or Very sad

**Lamplighter** Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:18 pm

Amnesty International critical of Hungary's asylum system

BUDAPEST, Hungary (AP) — Asylum seekers are being mistreated in Hungary and its asylum system is "blatantly designed" to deter refugees from seeking protection there, rights group Amnesty International said in a report released Tuesday. September 27, 2016

Amnesty's findings in its "Stranded Hope" report echoed similar research released in past weeks by other groups like Human Rights Watch and which have been rejected by the Hungarian government. Amnesty was also critical of Hungary's efforts — since new rules went into effect on July 5 — to "push back" to Serbia asylum seekers detained up to 8 kilometers (5 miles) from the border. Several people interviewed by Amnesty claimed that they have been beaten, kicked and chased by dogs during their forced returns.

"Appalling treatment and labyrinthine asylum procedures are a cynical ploy to deter asylum seekers from Hungary's ever more militarized borders," said John Dalhuisen, Amnesty International's Director for Europe. "Against the backdrop of a toxic referendum campaign, poisonous anti-refugee rhetoric is reaching fever pitch."

Hungary will hold a government-sponsored referendum on Sunday meant to build political support against any future European Union plans to resettle refugees among member states. The government's ubiquitous billboard and media campaign has been accused of fomenting xenophobia and anti-migrant prejudices.

Government spokesman Zoltan Kovacs said earlier that allegations about police beatings of migrants were "sheer lies" and that all reports of abuse had been investigated. Kovacs also said that changes to Hungary's asylum system, including the closure of reception centers and less integration assistance, were needed "because migrants very consciously misuse the existing system."

Hungary's decision to process only up to 15 asylum claims per day at each of two "transit zones" on the Serbian border has stranded hundreds of asylum seekers on the Serbian side of the razor-wire border fence which Prime Minister Viktor Orban ordered to be built last year.

Amnesty also called on European leaders to "robustly challenge Hungary's breaches of EU law" to avoid its practices from spreading to other European countries.

**bb1** Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:56 pm

Has Amnesty explained why it's OK to just march into other people's countries and demand free stuff? That's generally called 'invading' - especially when it's being done by large numbers of aggressive young men.

What about the rights of Hungarian people? Or don't they matter?

**Lamplighter** Tue Sep 27, 2016 2:22 pm

"Against the backdrop of a toxic referendum campaign, poisonous anti-refugee rhetoric is reaching fever pitch."

Really? Amd where would that be heard, pray? Most of the Magyars I know and have dealings with are too busy trying to make ends meet, run village communities and carry on with their lives - not spout rhetoric against anyone, except it be the local authorities and on occasions the Government and the Prime Minister!. This is a small country, not rich and many of its people earn far less than other countries, but they are also a proud people, quick to stand up and express their opinions. I have lived here for over 10 years and I have never had any snide or anti-expat comments made at me or my friends, in fact I have been welcomed into peoples' homes. I am not a fan of Amnesty as you may have gathered! LL

**Lamplighter** Tue Sep 27, 2016 2:49 pm

Paeliamentray Committee: Budapest weekend blast not “ideologically motivated”
By Hungary Matters

According to information available it can be ruled out that the shrapnel bomb attack in central Budapest at the weekend was “ideologically motivated”, with no evidence pointing to any jihadist connection, Zsolt Molnár, the head of Parliament’s national security committee, said. The committee was convened to hold a joint session with the defence and law enforcement committee to hear reports about the bomb attack carried out at a ground-level shop near the Teréz ring road on Saturday evening. In the attack two police officers conducting a regular patrol were injured. One of them, a 23-year-old woman, was hospitalised with life threatening injuries. The other officer, a 26-year-old man, was taken to hospital with serious injuries. Both are in stable condition, but in intensive care, the national police chief said.

A home-made shrapnel bomb was used in the explosion, Károly Papp said. Police are looking for a suspect aged 20-25 and 170 centimetres in height, who was wearing a lightcoloured fishing cap, a dark canvas jacket, blue jeans and white trainers, he said, adding that there is a 10 million forint (EUR 32,600) reward for providing useful information on the suspect.
http://www.politics.hu/20160927/parliamentary-committee-budapest-weekend-blast-not-ideologically-motivated/

**bb1** Tue Sep 27, 2016 3:00 pm

I am not a fan of Amnesty as you may have gathered!

Me neither these days, LL - they pick and choose their causes too much. They're lost the moral authority they once had when they were standing up to the Soviet Union, etc.

This emotional blackmail disgusts me, frankly. The sensible thing to do when all this started would have been to sort out the Syrian Christians and Yazidi from the rest of the riff-raff - those groups are in genuine danger, are no danger to us, and the Christians in particular would have little trouble integrating.

Those hordes of aggressive young moslem men? Either send them back to the camps they came from or intern them where they can't rape/rob/murder/assault/blow up, etc., etc., innocent people.

But doubtless that would have been 'racist' or something, despite the fact that a belief system is NOT a race.

**Lamplighter** Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:57 pm

Pro-gov’t daily: Paris and Brussels bombers prepared action in Budapest
By Hungary Matters

Several perpetrators of the Paris and Brussels terrorist attacks in November last year and March 2016 spent time in Budapest, Tuesday’s Magyar Idők newspaper said, citing unnamed law enforcement sources. The terrorists trained by the Islamic State terrorist group used the so-called Balkan migrant route into Hungary, the paper said, citing Hungarian law enforcement. Magyar Idők said that Salah Abdeslam, one of the ringleaders, stayed in Hungary on three occasions in the period before the attacks. During his third time in Hungary, Abdeslam stayed at a hotel located in downtown Rákóczi Street, where police found a copy of the Belgian’s residence permit. Abdeslam used an Audi A6 to transport out of Hungary three men who committed the Bataclan Theatre attack.
http://www.politics.hu/20160928/pro-govt-daily-paris-and-brussels-bombers-prepared-action-in-budapest/

They had crossed at the Serbia- Hungary border using false Syrian passports and stayed at a hotel in the Zugló district of Budapest. At Keleti railway station, through a well-known money transfer system, the men got hold of 1,000 euros. The Hungarian authorities, acting on requests by their Belgian and French counterparts, established that ten of the bombers had travelled throughHungary between July and November 2015, the paper said.

**bb1** Wed Sep 28, 2016 5:11 pm

But Orban's the bad one for trying to keep them out of his country? I don't think so.....

**Lamplighter** Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:11 pm

Szijjártó says Hungary and the UK to establish bilateral business council

Hungary and the United Kingdom will establish a bilateral business council in the Hungarian embassy in London to promote bilateral trade ties, Hungary’s foreign minister said. The council will “serve to help coordinate and promote the business activities of Hungarian companies in Britain and the activities of British firms in Hungary”, Péter Szijjártó said. The Hungarian government aims to make sure that the “UK’s exit from the EU does not harm Hungarian-British relations”, he said. At the EU-UK “divorce talks” Hungary will push to ensure that Brexit does not dampen economic, investment and trade relations between the UK and the EU, Szijjártó said. He added that the government would protect the interests of Hungarian citizens working in the UK.

Szijjártó said a 492 million euro credit line is available from Eximbank to support Hungary-UK business links and help Hungarian SMEs reach the British market. The Hungarian government has signed strategic agreements with four British companies, namely Tesco, GlaxoSmithKline, Unilever and British Telecom, and all of them envisaged increasing the share of Hungarian suppliers. British Ambassador Iain Lindsay highlighted the importance of Hungarian-British trade relations.

**bb1** Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:17 pm

That's good, LL - nice to read some positive news! thumbsup

**Lamplighter** Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:36 pm

bb1 wrote:That's good, LL - nice to read some positive news!

Orban studied at Pembroke College and speaks perfect English. He is also a clever opportunist and Brexit has opened up quite a few ways for him to needle the Brussels crowd. (His time at Oxford was funded by the Soros Foundation, but don't hold it against him; he hates Soros and blames him for most of Europe's woes.) LL

**Lamplighter** Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:45 pm

Local Muslims wary of Hungary's anti-migrant referendum
BUDAPEST, Hungary (AP) — Muslims in Hungary say they are wary of the government's anti-migrant referendum which they say has boosted xenophobic feelings. Prime Minister Viktor Orban has said Hungarians have "no problems" with the local Muslim community, but that any mandatory European Union quotas to relocate asylum seekers, including many Muslims, would destroy Hungary's Christian identity and culture.

Orban hopes that rejecting the EU quotas in Sunday's referendum will force Brussels to reconsider the scheme. While Hungarians have been bombarded by the government's anti-migrant campaign, some 30 people took part in a "Muslims living among us" walking tour of a Budapest neighborhood to show the community's "human face."

Timea Nagy, a Hungarian Muslim who participated in the three-hour tour, said that "I'm starting to feel that my own homeland is repudiating me."
https://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4640900-local-muslims-wary-hungarys-anti-migrant-referendu.html#.1258-stage-hero1-5

**bb1** Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:58 pm

That's interesting, LL, and IMO highlights another problem caused by Merkel's madness - the effect on established, perfectly respectable, islamic communities.

The behaviour of a great many of the 'migrants' has been quite simply awful, even without the imported terrorism, and is liable to get the established communities tarred with the same brush, IMO.

**lily** Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:53 pm

That is what I have been saying here. Thanks guys.

**Lamplighter** Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:30 pm

Hungary holds referendum on EU mandatory migrant plan
People in Hungary are voting in a referendum on accepting mandatory EU quotas for relocating migrants.
Right-wing Prime Minister Viktor Orban opposes plans to relocate a total of 160,000 migrants across the bloc.
Under the scheme, announced after last year's migrant crisis, Hungary would receive 1,294 asylum seekers. More at link.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-37528325
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EU leader sees danger in Hungary migrant vote

BUDAPEST, Hungary (AP) — The president of the European Parliament is accusing Hungary of playing a "dangerous game" by holding a referendum on whether to accept mandatory European Union quotas for relocating asylum seekers.

Martin Schulz said in an interview published Sunday that Hungary would have to take in about 2,000 migrants under the quotas. Schulz told Germany's Funke newspaper group that the referendum called by Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban's challenges the legitimacy of European laws.

He also suggested that countries that fail to show solidary with the rest of the EU on the migrant issue may see their financial support from the bloc cut. Schulz called on European leaders to make clear to Eastern European countries that "solidarity isn't a one-way street," but rejected calls to eject Hungary from the EU.
------------
Vote in Hungary highlights snags in migrant relocation plan
BUDAPEST, Hungary (AP) — Hungary is holding a referendum Sunday against future European Union quotas for accepting asylum seekers, but schemes already in place to ensure EU member countries are taking in a fair share of the migrants reaching Europe hardly are working now.

https://www.mail.com/int/news/europe/4642326-vote-hungary-highlights-snags-migrant-relocation-p.html#.1258-stage-hero1-8

**bb1** Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:45 pm

Martin Schulz said in an interview published Sunday that Hungary would have to take in about 2,000 migrants under the quotas.

'Would have to'? They just aren't getting it - it is dictatorial attitudes like that that caused Brexit, IMO, and provoked the Hungarian referendum. Not to mention the ever-rising Right all over Europe.

I used to read books about subjects like the French Revolution, and wonder why the aristocrats didn't see how much danger they were in until it was too late.......

**bb1** Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:49 pm

PS - there would have been precious few 'migrants' reaching Europe if Merkel hadn't invited half of the Middle East and beyond into Germany. And compounded that by making NO effort to sort genuine refugees, like Christians and Yazidis, from the ravening mob in search of free stuff from the land of milk and honey - and access to stupid young women simpering #refugeeswelcome.

**Lamplighter** Sun Oct 02, 2016 1:51 pm

Just seen Orban on TV saying he will resign if he loses the referendum. LL

**bb1** Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:00 pm

I suspect he's safe enough.....any idea what time the result will be known, LL?

**Lamplighter** Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:10 pm

bb1 wrote:I suspect he's safe enough.....any idea what time the result will be known, LL?

Between 20.00 and 22.00 CET I understand. LL

**bb1** Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:12 pm

Thanks, should be interesting!

**Lamplighter** Sun Oct 02, 2016 5:28 pm

Hungary, Migrant Quota Referendum: Turnout 5.30 pm: 39.88% Requirement to oppose EU's plan: 50% +1 vote + majority of No

Szabolcs Panyi @panyiszabolcs
Just in: turnout of #Hungary's #QuotaReferendum at 17:30 is 39,88%, the final result expected to be around 43-46%. Polls close at 19:00.

Politics.hu@politicshu
Invalid voting sheets, transparent booths, essay instead of X, text message from Fidesz - a lot going on

Boris Kálnoky ‏@bkalnoky 3h3 hours ago
Quite a lot of voters seem to joyfully give invalid votes at #hungaryreferendum, writing detailed reasons for their vote on the ballot.

Boris Kálnoky ‏@bkalnoky 5h5 hours ago
Not looking good for the government. Only 23,56 % turnout with 4 hours to go. Referendum needs 50% *valid* turnout

Politics.hu ‏@politicshu 45m45 minutes ago
PM Orbán makes last gasp presence in Budapest District XVIIII Fidesz office to encourage voting (or staff)

Politics.hu ‏@politicshu 32m32 minutes ago
National Election Chairman: sufficient participation for valid quota referendum "highly unlikely"

**bb1** Sun Oct 02, 2016 6:59 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-37528325

A poll conducted by think-tank Nezopont indicated that about 3.2 million voters had rejected the quotas while 168,000 voters voted for them.
Gergely Gulyas, an MP of the governing Fidesz party, predicted that about 95% had voted 'No" and the turnout would be about 45%.

If that is anything like correct, then I suspect Orban will regard it as a big win, on the perfectly reasonable grounds that if you can't be bothered to vote, can't even be bothered to spoil your paper, then your opinion doesn't actually matter much.

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