Turkey shoots down Russian fighter

Pauly@spz_trader
‏@spz_trader
U.S. MILITARY SPOKESMAN SAYS TURKEY SHOOTDOWN TOOK PLACE "AT THE BORDER" BUT CAN'T OFFER PRECISE LOCATION ASSESSMENT YET

Which means it happened over Syria. As usual, the US has no satellite imagery to prove their Gallant Allies are the wronged party.

http://news.sky.com/story/1593241/putin-downing-of-jet-a-stab-in-the-back

A Turkish official said two Russian planes approached the Turkish border and were warned before one of them was shot down, adding their information shows Turkish airspace was repeatedly violated.

But a US official has said initial indications are that the incursion into Turkish airspace lasted a matter of seconds.

Looks like Turkey is on its own.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/621677/Reports-Russian-helicopter-shot-down-while-searching-downed-jets



In the disturbing film released by the Free Syrian Army rebel group a missile can be seen travelling towards the stricken chopper, which has landed in a mountainous area, before it explodes in a huge fireball.

Moments earlier a single soldier is seen assembling an American made TOW portable anti-tank missile launcher on a hillside before taking aim at the helicopter.

A narrator triumphantly gloats over the top of the video exclaiming "Allahu Akbar" - meaning "God is great" - as the missile hits and mangled wreckage from the craft is blasted into the air.

That's the heart-eating, cannibal, 'Free Syrian Army' that Obama has been supplying, and on whose behalf Cameron was all set to bomb Damascus a couple of years back.

They're all the same, and I personally don't care if Putin napalms the whole bloody lot of them.

NATO will be sorting this mess out?

I shudder to think what NATO is going to do, Lily. I suspect European NATO would like to drop Turkey like a hot potato - it's very close to a rogue state - but Washington is another matter.

One bit of better news:

Ibrahim Joudeh ‏@Ibra_Joudeh 2h2 hours ago
#Russian Helicopter Crew Arrived to Safety After Being Rescued by #SAA Special Forces in #Latakia Mountains
#Syria

BuzzFeed NewsVerified account
‏@BuzzFeedNews
.@POTUS on downed Russian plane: "Turkey has the right to defend its territory and airspace"



What more does anyone need to convince them that Obama is backing terrorists? In the company of the King of Jordan, Putin came right out and said that Turkey was buying all that oil from ISIS, yet Obama doesn't turn a hair.

Where are Washington's Praetorian Guards? They should be arresting Obama for treason against the whole of the civilised world.

*SIGH*

Turkey and Washtington might just - just - about have got away with this unscathed if the pilots had survived, Lily - if they'd said it was a 'misunderstanding', etc. Lessons learned on both sides, all the usual soothing noises.

But right now, anyone on earth with an internet link can see Washington's pet terrorists from the FSA murdering the Russian pilots - and shooting down a rescue helicopter with Washington-supplied weapons.

It's decided me that the UK should NOT be intervening, Turkey cannot be trusted, and any RAF pilots that fell into FSA hands would get the same treatment. Russia can wipe the whole lot out, I find myself not caring about one single person that shouts, Aluha Akbar any more.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-24/russian-pilots-executed-while-parachuting-turkish-media?page=9

Comment:

The Turkey part of this can be handled with diplomatic bullshit. The rebels shooting the pilots as they parachute and shooting down a rescue chopper gives Putin cover and a green light to mount a massive ground operation in the area. The rebels will be forced to flee over into Turkey and any dream of a "Free Syria" will be squashed. Kerry and McCain won't be able to save the "moderates" without direct US involvement and they won't do that. Most Americans don't give two shits who runs Syria but they do want ISIS gone. After Russia destroys the Free Syria Army the West will be forced to accept Assad staying and co-operate with Putin in fighting ISIS

And Putin will also give the Kurds - whom Turkey is bombing - any weaponry that takes their fancy.

It has just been announced that NATO said the Russian plane was in Turkish airspace.....

Looking at the data released by the Turkish military:



it probably was, Lily - for all of thirty seconds. No time for all this warning-sending, etc., that's been claimed.

It's a matter of record that Turkish planes enter Greek airspace continually, so maybe Greece will start returning the favour?

This is interesting, though maybe not entirely accurate:

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/11/24/turkish-f16-fighter-shot-down-russian-su24-jet-over-syria-mod-confirms-video/

President Putin personally confirms the attack was over Syrian territory.

Erdogan’s insane actions were done in consultation, according to sources, with Senator John McCain, unsuccessful presidential candidate and current head of the Senate Armed Forces Committee. McCain is said to have made assurances to Turkey that NATO commander, General Phillip Breedlove, would “personally” extend the protection of American strategic nuclear forces over Turkey if a direct confrontation with Russia ensued.

McCain assured Erdogan, according to sources, that the Pentagon was ready to move against Obama and that Russia, knowing this, would back down. What Erdogan fails to grasp, however, is that McCain, rumored to be increasingly mentally unstable, represents a groups of “End Times” religious extremists which include Lindsey Graham, Ted Cruz, Rand Paul and all but two of the huge field of Republican presidential candidates to whom nuclear apocalypse has long been a goal.

Moreover, the 3 recent “events,” the Sinai “crash,” the attack on the Crimea power grid and the downing of the SU24 are pure provocation. Ostensibly, this is an American move, we believe, to convince the Saudi’s and Gulf States that America is not abandoning the Middle East and is ready to play “brinksmanship” with Russia as it had done at the height of the Cold War. It is also based on an American assessment of Putin himself, that he is a pragmatist and will back down.

The strong political divisions within the US, a weakened State Department and a deeply divided Department of Defense, along with a congress controlled by special interests, has allowed Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Israel and Ukraine to “go rogue” against Russia. Only Israel’s Netanyahu has kept, just possibly, the option of backing out of the secret American “cabal” that is targeting Putin.

Erdogan’s insane actions were done in consultation, according to sources, with Senator John McCain

Now that sounds entirely possible. I don't see Rand Paul as being one of those End Time loonies, though.

https://www.rt.com/news/323329-russia-suspend-military-turkey/


Moscow plans to suspend military cooperation with Ankara after the downing of a Russian bomber by Turkish air forces, Russian General Staff representatives said on Tuesday. Further measures to beef up Russian air base security in Syria will also be taken.
Follow LIVE UPDATES on Russian warplane shot down at Syria-Turkey border

Sergey Rudskoy, a top official with the Russian General Staff, condemned the attack on the Russian bomber in Syrian airspace by a Turkish fighter jet as “a severe violation of international law”. He stressed that the Su-24 was downed over the Syrian territory. The crash site was four kilometers away from the Turkish border, he said.

Rudskoy said the Russian warplane did not violate Turkish airspace. Additionally, according to the Hmeymim airfield radar, it was the Turkish fighter jet that actually entered Syrian airspace as it attacked the Russian bomber.

The Turkish fighter jet made no attempts to contact Russian pilots before attacking the bomber, Rudskoy added.

“We assume the strike was carried out with a close range missile with an infra-red seeker,” Rudskoy said. “The Turkish jet made no attempts to communicate or establish visual contact with our crew that our equipment would have registered. The Su-24 was hit by a missile over Syria’s territory.”

Russia now plans to implement new measures aimed at strengthening the security of the country’s air base in Syria and in particular to bolster air defense.

Russian guided missile cruiser Moskva, equipped with the ‘Fort’ air defense system, similar to the S-300, will be deployed off Latakia province's coast.

"We warn that every target posing a potential threat will be destroyed,” lieutenant general Sergey Rudskoy said during the briefing.

“All military contacts with Turkey will be suspended,” he added.

DETAILS TO FOLLOW

It's easy for NATO to prove that Turkey is telling the truth, actually. Just release the voice recorders from their side with all those warnings that have been claimed....

BNO News ‏@BNONews 3h3 hours ago
Tape played at NATO meeting showed Turkey warned Russian jet 21 times in 5 minutes before shooting it down, NATO official tells Channel 4

Release it, then - or is it like the Ukrainian 'proof' that turned out to be from Call of Duty?

PS - How did it take the Russian plane 5 minutes to cross that tiny sliver of land shown on Turkey's own charts?

So, if the straying planes of 'unknown origin' had turned out to be US planes, what do we think would be happening right now?

If an American plane had been shot down by Turkey, and the crew murdered, in a war crime, by the very terrorists the US has been supporting?

I am afraid I believe that Turkey knew all along that they were Russian, and that Washington had their back - no-one sane risks starting World War 3 over a 17-second incursion.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-24/russia-escalates-suspends-military-cooperation-turkey-moves-warship-coast-destroy-an

Here is The Turkish version mapping of the flight paths.



Turkey's own map would appear to show that Turkey flew into Syrian air space...

As pointed out in comments-

The measured distance of the Su-24's alleged incursion into Turkish airspace is 2.39 miles from entrance to exit.

http://www.freemaptools.com/measure-distance.htm

At a crusing speed of 300mph, the Su-24 would only be in Turkish territory for about 28 seconds.

There is no way the Turkish F-16 could have fired, and struck, the Su-24 while it was still in Turkish territory. Either the pilot fired before the Su-24 entered Turkish airspace, or else the F-16 struck the Russian plane after it had left Turkey.

Something clearly does not add up.

One small bit of good news....the second pilot has been rescued, and not murdered by Obama's pet terrorists, as earlier feared:

https://www.rt.com/news/323240-russia-turkey-warplane-downed/

09:24 GMT
The pilot of the Su-24 who was killed in the incident will be awarded a posthumous Hero of the Russian Federation award, the highest honorary title in Russia, Vladimir Putin said. The second pilot rescued by Russian and Syrian special forces will also receive a medal, Putin added.

The internet is not Turkey's friend...

Marco Pierre Shite ‏@Marco_P_Shite 22m22 minutes ago
Meanwhile on Facebook!

An excellent dissection of Turkey's nonsense:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-24/17-seconds-changed-world-leaked-letter-exposes-turkeys-hair-trigger-reality

Including:

So, as RT notes, even if we buy Turkey's story (i.e. if we accept that Russia actually did violate Turkish airspace), then it would appear that Ankara has something of an itchy trigger finger. That is, Turkey was apparently willing to risk sparking a wider conflict between NATO and Russia over a 17 second incursion.

But something doesn't sound right.

WikiLeaks ✔ @wikileaks
Journalists: Learn to do basic maths. Look at Turkey's statement to UN: 1.15 miles / 17 seconds x 60 x 60 = 243 miles/hour = 391 km/hour
5:04 PM - 24 Nov 2015

In other words, as Sputnik put it earlier this evening, "according to those numbers, the Su-24 would have had to be flying at stall speed."

The Su-24's max speed is 1,320 km/hour.

So if we assume the Su-24 was actually going much faster, was 17 seconds more like 5 seconds? Or perhaps even less?

Quite.

More bad news for Turkey-

https://www.rt.com/news/323431-saved-pilot-turkish-su24/



The pilot that was rescued from Obama's pet jihadists is talking to the media.


“In actual fact there were no warnings at all. Neither through the radio, nor visually, so we did not at any point adjust our course. You need to understand the difference in speed between a tactical bomber like a Su-24, and that of the F16. If they wanted to warn us, they could have sat on our wing,” said Murakhtin, who is currently recuperating at Russia’s airbase in Latakia, northern Syria.

“As it was, the missile hit the back of our plane out of nowhere. We didn’t even have time to make an evasive maneuver.”

One suspects this is only the beginning of Turkey's troubles - not least because the whole world is now talking about them aiding and abetting ISIS, and about Obama's pets murdering the Russian pilot.

Oh, and there's even a hashtag now, so it must be serious...

https://twitter.com/hashtag/istandwithrussia?f=tweets&vertical=news&src=hash